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Series Thread: ECF: Boston Celtics vs Cleveland Cavs

trojanfan12

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Anyone see the cavs win 4 out of the next 5 games playing like this? Despite a 40 point triple-double from lebron?

The bold is what's scary. If Lebron can put a game like that and the Cavs still lose by 13...it's pretty tough to imagine them winning the series.

Obviously they still can, but it's going to be really tough.
 

trojanfan12

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Hey, being a Celtics fan I have to throw rocks at the Lakers, I'm sure you understand.

True, but there's also always been a mutual respect between Lakers fans and Celtics fans.

I may not like the Celtics, but I respect them way too much to wish JR Smith on them.
 

tlance

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Whats wrong with his supporting cast? He has Kevin love for god sakes and a bunch of 3 point sharpshooters for god sakes. Not enough to beat Rookies/Sophmores/20 year olds with no Irving and Heyward?

Have you watched either of these games?

They traded for Clarkson,Nance and Hood because they were old and slow. But, those guys are struggling offensively, so Korver, Smith, Love and TT are getting most of the minutes. The Celtics are literally running circles around them because they are so much more athletic. They get whatever shot they want, while the Cavs are completely 100% reliant on whatever James can create.

Since Boston is arguably the best defensive team in the entire league, James can't create the same quality looks that the Celtics are getting.

Lue is never going to oatcoach Brad Stevens and the Celtics have much more talent after LeBron. Kevin Love is horribly overrated. LeBron is the best player in this series, but Horford, Brown, Tatum, and Rozier have all been better than Love. Hell, Morris and Smart arguably have been too.

I have a difficult time seeing Cleveland winning this series at this point. Never going to count LeBron out, but the Celtics are a much better team.
 

tlance

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This Celtics team reminds me of the 1975 Warriors championship team. A whole bunch of athletic contributors who played harder than the opposition.
I don't see this year's Warriors squad, if they can upset the Rockets some how, having too much trouble with the Celtics though.

Upset?

Are you still pretending that the Rockets are the favorite?

I did not see a single expert pick Houston to win the series before game 1. They may have had home court. But they were never the favorite. Golden State is the far superior team. Like everyone has been telling you all season long.
 

tlance

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The bold is what's scary. If Lebron can put a game like that and the Cavs still lose by 13...it's pretty tough to imagine them winning the series.

Obviously they still can, but it's going to be really tough.

You know what is crazy though?

LeBron actually didn't play all that well.

He made a bunch of 3s early on, but was more or less average shooting after the first quarter. Not bad, but not great. He turned the ball over 6 times and went 5-10 from the line.

LeBron must be better than this for Cleveland to win. Not saying he needs to score 50 (he might), but he does need to be more efficient. Boston is the far superior team.
 

Black Adam

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You know what is crazy though?

LeBron actually didn't play all that well.

He made a bunch of 3s early on, but was more or less average shooting after the first quarter. Not bad, but not great. He turned the ball over 6 times and went 5-10 from the line.

LeBron must be better than this for Cleveland to win. Not saying he needs to score 50 (he might), but he does need to be more efficient. Boston is the far superior team.

were kinda on the same page there, coach...

LeClown did chuck up a bunch of treys early on. my guess is he was trying to spread the C's defense so he could get the running lanes he was used to getting, but the speed of their 'D' obviously countered that. so it was relatively easy for them to survive the Cavs initial onslaught...

as far as the TO's go, you're right. 7 and 6 respectively the last 2 games for the so-called "king". though imo i think it's once again that defense giving him fits more than him not having his head in the game...

as far as his FT shooting goes, meh. the guy's less than 75% for his CAREER, so while subpar, whouldn't have made that much of a difference...

still, you're pretty much spot-on. not trying to give you any grief...
 

Heatles84

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Well except the rest of the team on the Bulls in '86 were awful. The Cavs have reached multiple finals and still have two HOFers and solid role players who can hit the 3.

There's Lebron. Who's the other?
 

Rock Strongo

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lebron looked...really tired late in this game.

hes feeling his age, even with his numbers.
 

Heatles84

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You know what is crazy though?

LeBron actually didn't play all that well.

He made a bunch of 3s early on, but was more or less average shooting after the first quarter. Not bad, but not great. He turned the ball over 6 times and went 5-10 from the line.

LeBron must be better than this for Cleveland to win. Not saying he needs to score 50 (he might), but he does need to be more efficient. Boston is the far superior team.

About as accurate as you can get.

And this is why I feel like last night with the draft lotto results and the game that Lebron had while still losing by double digits is why he's on his way out.
 

TurnUpTheHeat

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Brad Botkin CBS Sports

"It felt like an official transition of power.

Which brings us back to those lottery results, and that No. 8 pick the Cavs had to swallow. Remember, that pick was the one hope Cleveland had left of salvaging anything of real value from the trade that sent Kyrie Irving to Boston last summer. It belonged to the Nets, and the hope was that the Nets would be worse than they wound up being, and perhaps that pick would end up in the top three, where they could land either a foundational talent to build around in the event that LeBron leaves this summer, or a high-leverage asset to trade for a second star in an effort to keep LeBron.

The No. 8 pick accomplishes neither.

Now, to be clear, here's the original package the Cavs got in return for Irving: Isiah Thomas (no longer with the team), Jae Crowder (no longer with the team), Ante Zizic (you've probably never heard of him) and now the No. 8 pick. For Kyrie Irving. A borderline MVP-caliber player who hit the biggest shot in franchise history. I realize Irving pretty much forced his way out and the Cavs had to take what they could get, but still, this is hard to stomach.

Because now the Cavs really, seriously, have to start thinking about life with LeBron. Who knows, maybe they come back and win this series. I seriously doubt it, but maybe. Either way, if you watched this team play Tuesday night, there just aren't very many true basketball reasons, if any at all, for James to come back. He's running out of time. This team is nowhere close to where the Celtics are going to be next year when Gordon Hayward and Irving return, let alone the top teams in the West. If he wants to stay at home for personal reasons, that's one thing. But purely through the prism off basketball, there's just nothing left there for him.

We're talking no cap space to add a free agent, almost no trade value for anyone on their team, and four guys in Rodney Hood, Larry Nance, Jordan Clarkson and George Hill -- all of whom they traded for at the deadline -- who are making basically zero impact in this series. Again, had the Cavs beat the lottery odds and come out with even a top-five pick, there would be something to celebrate. But No. 8? And a 2-0 deficit to Boston to boot?

Yeah, the Cavs took an old-fashioned shot to the jaw on Tuesday, and unlike the Celtics, you have to questions their collective ability to rise from the mat and come right back swinging. For starters, they're just not as good as the Celtics. They're outmatched at four of the five positions, pretty significantly at three of them, and they have almost no depth. LeBron is their only chance, and again, we saw that wasn't enough in Game 2. He wound up with 42 points, 12 assists and 10 boards, and yet the Cavs were still outscored by nine points in the minutes he was on the floor.

Beyond the basketball, there was a play toward the end of the game that says a lot about where these two teams are at. Al Horford had a free lane to the rim and J.R. Smith shoved him in the back in midair. It was a cheap shot, absolutely uncalled for by Smith, and it took Marcus Smart, who is pretty much a junkyard dog in a tank top, about a half-second to jump right in Smith's face in defense of his teammate.

How many Cavs came to the defense of Smith?

Zero.

What we have here is one team in the Celtics that is entirely connected, 1-12 on the floor but really from the front office down, and one team in Cleveland that is doesn't even really know what it's fighting for anymore. Is it to actually win this series? Or is it to just do enough to keep LeBron? Or, possibly, have they secretly given up on both? "




@WiggyRuss
Interesting irony the Cavs find themselves in a place with no cap space, almost no trade value for anyone on their team, and a bunch of bad contract no impact players.
 

Heatles84

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Brad Botkin CBS Sports

"It felt like an official transition of power.

Which brings us back to those lottery results, and that No. 8 pick the Cavs had to swallow. Remember, that pick was the one hope Cleveland had left of salvaging anything of real value from the trade that sent Kyrie Irving to Boston last summer. It belonged to the Nets, and the hope was that the Nets would be worse than they wound up being, and perhaps that pick would end up in the top three, where they could land either a foundational talent to build around in the event that LeBron leaves this summer, or a high-leverage asset to trade for a second star in an effort to keep LeBron.

The No. 8 pick accomplishes neither.

Now, to be clear, here's the original package the Cavs got in return for Irving: Isiah Thomas (no longer with the team), Jae Crowder (no longer with the team), Ante Zizic (you've probably never heard of him) and now the No. 8 pick. For Kyrie Irving. A borderline MVP-caliber player who hit the biggest shot in franchise history. I realize Irving pretty much forced his way out and the Cavs had to take what they could get, but still, this is hard to stomach.

Because now the Cavs really, seriously, have to start thinking about life with LeBron. Who knows, maybe they come back and win this series. I seriously doubt it, but maybe. Either way, if you watched this team play Tuesday night, there just aren't very many true basketball reasons, if any at all, for James to come back. He's running out of time. This team is nowhere close to where the Celtics are going to be next year when Gordon Hayward and Irving return, let alone the top teams in the West. If he wants to stay at home for personal reasons, that's one thing. But purely through the prism off basketball, there's just nothing left there for him.

We're talking no cap space to add a free agent, almost no trade value for anyone on their team, and four guys in Rodney Hood, Larry Nance, Jordan Clarkson and George Hill -- all of whom they traded for at the deadline -- who are making basically zero impact in this series. Again, had the Cavs beat the lottery odds and come out with even a top-five pick, there would be something to celebrate. But No. 8? And a 2-0 deficit to Boston to boot?

Yeah, the Cavs took an old-fashioned shot to the jaw on Tuesday, and unlike the Celtics, you have to questions their collective ability to rise from the mat and come right back swinging. For starters, they're just not as good as the Celtics. They're outmatched at four of the five positions, pretty significantly at three of them, and they have almost no depth. LeBron is their only chance, and again, we saw that wasn't enough in Game 2. He wound up with 42 points, 12 assists and 10 boards, and yet the Cavs were still outscored by nine points in the minutes he was on the floor.

Beyond the basketball, there was a play toward the end of the game that says a lot about where these two teams are at. Al Horford had a free lane to the rim and J.R. Smith shoved him in the back in midair. It was a cheap shot, absolutely uncalled for by Smith, and it took Marcus Smart, who is pretty much a junkyard dog in a tank top, about a half-second to jump right in Smith's face in defense of his teammate.

How many Cavs came to the defense of Smith?

Zero.

What we have here is one team in the Celtics that is entirely connected, 1-12 on the floor but really from the front office down, and one team in Cleveland that is doesn't even really know what it's fighting for anymore. Is it to actually win this series? Or is it to just do enough to keep LeBron? Or, possibly, have they secretly given up on both? "




@WiggyRuss
Interesting irony the Cavs find themselves in a place with no cap space, almost no trade value for anyone on their team, and a bunch of bad contract no impact players.

Ah, the irony. This is my favorite article.
 

Heatles84

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Pretty much like the writer knows and is taking personal shots @WiggyRuss

I'm still holding onto that quote that we're stuck with the team we deserve. In two months, Wiggy's going to be doing a complete 180, or he's going to bandwagon to the team that Lebron goes to next.
 

TurnUpTheHeat

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I'm still holding onto that quote that we're stuck with the team we deserve. In two months, Wiggy's going to be doing a complete 180, or he's going to bandwagon to the team that Lebron goes to next.


Or he'll be nowhere to be seen.

To be fair, matching the Tyler offer really never made a ton of sense being though the first 2 years when he was a deal were years we had no chance to do anything.

And, the game is getting more and more away from needing players like Whiteside.
If the team/coach isn't committed to finding ways to make teams pay for going small, then they shouldn't have kept him.
 
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