Worried About The Yorks

[Montalban]

I'm not seeing any free agent signings lately after all the talk about the money the Niners had available. I'm starting to worry about the Yorks' reputation for cheapskatedness and when push cam to shove they could not part with all that profit they've made/.

Hopefully they are playing the game the other teams are playing and trying to out-2wit the free agents and sign them cheaper.

 

[poewelch84]

I'm not seeing any free agent signings lately after all the talk about the money the Niners had available. I'm starting to worry about the Yorks' reputation for cheapskatedness and when push cam to shove they could not part with all that profit they've made/.

Hopefully they are playing the game the other teams are playing and trying to out-2wit the free agents and sign them cheaper.

Of course they could also be looking to keep cap space to retain players rather than go after free agents. Most of the best teams develop talent through the draft.

 

[Niner Outlaw]

I'm not seeing any free agent signings lately after all the talk about the money the Niners had available. I'm starting to worry about the Yorks' reputation for cheapskatedness and when push cam to shove they could not part with all that profit they've made/.

Hopefully they are playing the game the other teams are playing and trying to out-2wit the free agents and sign them cheaper.

Are you kidding? You're not seeing any signings lately and that makes you worry? Smh.

Cheap owners don't make a QB with 7 starts the highest paid QB in history.
Cheap owners don't make a center coming off IR the 2nd highest paid center in the league.
Cheap owners don't make a part-time RB the 4th highest paid RB in the league.
Cheap owners don't keep perpetually injured Jimmie Ward on the roster at a guaranteed 8.5M.

Since then we've signed Sherman for a song and took a couple of FA fliers on guys like Attaochu and Cooper.

It has nothing to do with the Yorks. The reason you don't see any signings lately is b/c FA is basically over. It's over b/c all the FAs worth any real money have signed somewhere (except Suh). What exactly do you think should be happening right now???

 

[MHSL82]

I'm not seeing any free agent signings lately after all the talk about the money the Niners had available. I'm starting to worry about the Yorks' reputation for cheapskatedness and when push cam to shove they could not part with all that profit they've made/.

Hopefully they are playing the game the other teams are playing and trying to out-2wit the free agents and sign them cheaper.

Why do people keep acting like owners make more money by not using the cap? There's a salary cap and if they don't use it it is rolled over to the next year. There's a minimum amount you have to spend. Do the owners get to keep the money they didn't spend an invest it for interest/capital gain? Or does it belong to the NFL? If you don't know the answer, please don't guess. Does anyone know?

Otherwise, they make more money by making the playoffs, advertisements, endorsements, etc. that a better team with presumably higher paid better players would point in the direction of not being cheap. Where teams can be cheap is with coaches and stadium deals, etc. They can also charge too much for seats, etc.

 

[deep9er]

Of course they could also be looking to keep cap space to retain players rather than go after free agents. Most of the best teams develop talent through the draft.

Yep, we already added FA's and adding more now would be "building with Free Agents". Adding more now is inefficient, and one might even argue we already added too much? Attoachu, Cooper, and even Sherman are on "prove it" signings? IMO it isn't likely we keep every FA already signed.

We now want the draft picks to fill a few spots, and add competition.

 

[Montalban]

Of course they could also be looking to keep cap space to retain players rather than go after free agents. Most of the best teams develop talent through the draft.

They have so many needs though where even signing a mediocre player would be an improvement over what they currently have. They have a good opportunity to compete for a spot in the post season this year if they get the right complementary pieces in place now.

 

[Montalban]

Are you kidding? You're not seeing any signings lately and that makes you worry? Smh.

Cheap owners don't make a QB with 7 starts the highest paid QB in history.
Cheap owners don't make a center coming off IR the 2nd highest paid center in the league.
Cheap owners don't make a part-time RB the 4th highest paid RB in the league.
Cheap owners don't keep perpetually injured Jimmie Ward on the roster at a guaranteed 8.5M.

Since then we've signed Sherman for a song and took a couple of FA fliers on guys like Attaochu and Cooper.

It has nothing to do with the Yorks. The reason you don't see any signings lately is b/c FA is basically over. It's over b/c all the FAs worth any real money have signed somewhere (except Suh). What exactly do you think should be happening right now???

Your head must have been inside an orifice it shouldn't have been the last several years if you don't know that the Yorks are in it for the money and are notorious cheapskates.

 

[Montalban]

Why do people keep acting like owners make more money by not using the cap? There's a salary cap and if they don't use it it is rolled over to the next year. There's a minimum amount you have to spend. Do the owners get to keep the money they didn't spend an invest it for interest/capital gain? Or does it belong to the NFL? If you don't know the answer, please don't guess. Does anyone know?

Otherwise, they make more money by making the playoffs, advertisements, endorsements, etc. that a better team with presumably higher paid better players would point in the direction of not being cheap. Where teams can be cheap is with coaches and stadium deals, etc. They can also charge too much for seats, etc.

Because they do.

 

[Montalban]

Yep, we already added FA's and adding more now would be "building with Free Agents". Adding more now is inefficient, and one might even argue we already added too much? Attoachu, Cooper, and even Sherman are on "prove it" signings? IMO it isn't likely we keep every FA already signed.

We now want the draft picks to fill a few spots, and add competition.

Sounds like for some reason you think that's a bad idea?

 

[poewelch84]

Sounds like for some reason you think that's a bad idea?

Ok so let's say they do build through free agency and sign Norwell, and Robinson probably the only guys they could have added to make a big difference. Then they deplete the cap and when good players on their roster need to be resigned like Buckner or any one of their safeties they may not have the money to get that done. You have to use both free agency and the draft to create winning teams in the salary cap era.

 

[Niner Outlaw]

Your head must have been inside an orifice it shouldn't have been the last several years if you don't know that the Yorks are in it for the money and are notorious cheapskates.

I'll bet I've been a Niner fan longer than you've been alive. Almost all of the owners are in it for the money. An NFL team is a bottomless cash machine. That's why it costs so much to buy a team.

You didn't answer my question or address my response. Give it a try.

You're not seeing any signings lately.
Who is out there to sign?
Who was out there a few days that you think the Yorks were too cheap to sign?

The fact is FA is essentially over b/c anyone worth signing to any real money is already signed and taht was still the case several days ago. Your post didn't make much sense and when I pointed it out, you resorted to insults. Try again.

They have so many needs though where even signing a mediocre player would be an improvement over what they currently have. They have a good opportunity to compete for a spot in the post season this year if they get the right complementary pieces in place now.

Like who?

 

[Niner Outlaw]

Ok so let's say they do build through free agency and sign Norwell, and Robinson probably the only guys they could have added to make a big difference. Then they deplete the cap and when good players on their roster need to be resigned like Buckner or any one of their safeties they may not have the money to get that done. You have to use both free agency and the draft to create winning teams in the salary cap era.

I think we all wanted Robinson. Apparently, the Bears outbid us for him. MattM reported that the Niners never went after Norwell (did the coaches think he didn't fit our scheme? Does Shanny value OGs that much?). That says the FO wasn't interested in him or they have their eyes on some OGs in the draft.

The 45M and change we have in space now is very important. As you point out, we shouldn't be wasting it. About 10M of it will go signing our rookie class. That'll leave 35M or so. Figure we carry over 30M to next year and the 50-55M we're projected to have turns into 80-85M in space.

In March of next year, that 80M will go a long way to landing us an impact FA or 2. Not to mention we'll have contract decisions to make on Bucker, T.Brown J.Tartt, Armstead, and Ward:
--Bucker will be entering the last year of his deal (then 5th year option if no new deal).
--Brown will likely want LT money and we all saw Solder sign for more than 15M/year
--If Tartt stays healthy, he'll command a pretty good deal too
--Do we exercise Armstead's 5th year option, extend him, let him go or trade him?
--Ward will be hurt again (we know that), but for some reason the coaches love paying him

 

[Niner Outlaw]

Ok so let's say they do build through free agency and sign Norwell, and Robinson probably the only guys they could have added to make a big difference. Then they deplete the cap and when good players on their roster need to be resigned like Buckner or any one of their safeties they may not have the money to get that done. You have to use both free agency and the draft to create winning teams in the salary cap era.

Like I said in my post above, we're projected to ahve 50-55M in space in 2019, and we'v got a few of our own to resign....but when I said we could pick up a big FA upgrade in 2019, look at the players set to be FAs in 2019:

Edge K.Mack, J.Clowney, E.Ansah, D.Lawrence, R.Quinn, S.Barrett
OG Z.Martin
WR O.Beckham, Jr., S.Diggs, B.Cooks, R.Cobb, K.Benjamin, D.Funchess
ILB E.Kendricks
S E.Thomas, L.Collins, L.Joyner, H.Clinton-Dix

Even if some of them get tagged, a good GM would rather have 80M in space than 50M.

 

[Ricky Roma]

Of course they could also be looking to keep cap space to retain players rather than go after free agents.

This. It is a great position to be in, when we have plenty of cash to resign our own, carry over to next year....or sign guys who will be casualties because teams pushed it to the brink of their own cap, and are forced to release guys.

As I can see it....the most concerning thing at this point is the status of R. Foster. I'm not even thinking about all the cash on hand.

 

[Pattersonca65]

They have so many needs though where even signing a mediocre player would be an improvement over what they currently have. They have a good opportunity to compete for a spot in the post season this year if they get the right complementary pieces in place now.

Why overpay for mediocre players when you can draft long term better players? They are still in pretty good situation cap wise and they are probably looking down the road a couple of years when it will be time to extend some players

 

[Pattersonca65]

Your head must have been inside an orifice it shouldn't have been the last several years if you don't know that the Yorks are in it for the money and are notorious cheapskates.

I think much of what has been said about the Yorks isn't due to them wanting to save money During the Harbaugh era, the 49ers were among the league leaders in player payroll and had one of the highest paid coaching staffs. That changed to do many factors. As for spending on free agents during the Baalke era, that wasn't because the York's didn't want to spend. Baalke was a notoriously conservative GM. He did not believe in spending big in FA and preferred building through the draft. Above all Baalke wanted to horde draft and comp picks thinking he could build the roster that way

 

[Pattersonca65]

I think we all wanted Robinson. Apparently, the Bears outbid us for him. MattM reported that the Niners never went after Norwell (did the coaches think he didn't fit our scheme? Does Shanny value OGs that much?). That says the FO wasn't interested in him or they have their eyes on some OGs in the draft.

The 45M and change we have in space now is very important. As you point out, we shouldn't be wasting it. About 10M of it will go signing our rookie class. That'll leave 35M or so. Figure we carry over 30M to next year and the 50-55M we're projected to have turns into 80-85M in space.

In March of next year, that 80M will go a long way to landing us an impact FA or 2. Not to mention we'll have contract decisions to make on Bucker, T.Brown J.Tartt, Armstead, and Ward:
--Bucker will be entering the last year of his deal (then 5th year option if no new deal).
--Brown will likely want LT money and we all saw Solder sign for more than 15M/year
--If Tartt stays healthy, he'll command a pretty good deal too
--Do we exercise Armstead's 5th year option, extend him, let him go or trade him?
--Ward will be hurt again (we know that), but for some reason the coaches love paying him

I really didn't want Robinson for the kind of money he signed for.

 

[Pattersonca65]

As I think about the cap moving forward next year, how will these recently signed contracts affect the cap moving forward? Sherman's and McKinnon's contracts have incentives and roster bonuses that I imagine are not accounted for the cap. Assuming the best case scenario and they earn those bonuses and incentives it would take something off next year's cap. I know they have done some contracts like that, not sure how much the future cap would be affected.

 

[Ricky Roma]

I think much of what has been said about the Yorks isn't due to them wanting to save money During the Harbaugh era, the 49ers were among the league leaders in player payroll and had one of the highest paid coaching staffs. That changed to do many factors. As for spending on free agents during the Baalke era, that wasn't because the York's didn't want to spend. Baalke was a notoriously conservative GM. He did not believe in spending big in FA and preferred building through the draft. Above all Baalke wanted to horde draft and comp picks thinking he could build the roster that way

York Sr. was cheap around the facilities and such...and that's where the paranoia began. It doesn't hold up when you go towards the players.....Go ask Nate Clements if the man is cheap.

York Jr. is paying so many former ex-coaches, it's laughable. I'm sure Fred O'Connor is still enjoying a payday (if he's still alive)

 

[Pattersonca65]

York Sr. was cheap around the facilities and such...and that's where the paranoia began. It doesn't hold up when you go towards the players.....Go ask Nate Clements if the man is cheap.

York Jr. is paying so many former ex-coaches, it's laughable. I'm sure Fred O'Connor is still enjoying a payday (if he's still alive)

You are right. There was that time with York Sr and the water bottles.