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Where does Randy Moss rank among the GOAT WRs?

GhostOfPoverty

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I think Moss was the most talented, and greatest receiver to ever play the game. Jerry Rice is obviously right up there, and most would call him #1 with Moss perhaps not even being their #2. But let's consider a few things.

Stats - Rice played 7 more seasons than Moss. Longevity counts for something, but Moss's 14 seasons isn't a small number for a WR either. Compare Rice's first 14 seasons to Moss's 14 year career - Rice: 206 games played, 1,139 receptions, 17,612 yards, 156 TDs. Moss: 218 GP, 982 Rec, 15,292 yrds, 156 TD. Rice literally played an extra half of Moss's career (and close to that of Terrell Owens's 15 years) compared to Moss's more modest, yet not short 14 years, to pad his stats with. Again, Rice deserves credit for remaining productive for so long, but let's not pretend that guys like Moss couldn't have put up sinilar stats had they hung around on (mostly) decent teams like Rice did with San Fran and early 2000's Oakland towards the end of his career. Basically, bearing all this in mind, I don't think Rice's insane stats alone make him the undisputed GOAT.

QBs - Moss had far worse QB play for his career than Rice did, and this isn't even debatable. Moss had 2 1/2 years of Tom Brady and 1 year of an ancient Randall Cunningham, with the rest of his career consisting mainly of scrubs, overrated (Culpepper, who was never anything without Moss), and washed up QBs. Rice on the other hand, had the luxury of having Joe Manontana and prime Steve Young for the vast majority of his career, and prime Rich Gannon in Oakland towards the end. A side note to this - Moss was forced to waste 2 years of his peime in Oakland when the whole team was a dumpster fire, and played on 3 different teams due to trades in 2012, severly hindering his production that year.



So... based on all that. My list of the GOAT WRs -
1 - Randy Moss
2 - Jerry Rice
3 - Terrell Owens

What do you guys think?
 

Nosferatu

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I think Moss was the most talented, and greatest receiver to ever play the game. Jerry Rice is obviously right up there, and most would call him #1 with Moss perhaps not even being their #2. But let's consider a few things.

Stats - Rice played 7 more seasons than Moss. Longevity counts for something, but Moss's 14 seasons isn't a small number for a WR either. Compare Rice's first 14 seasons to Moss's 14 year career - Rice: 206 games played, 1,139 receptions, 17,612 yards, 156 TDs. Moss: 218 GP, 982 Rec, 15,292 yrds, 156 TD. Rice literally played an extra half of Moss's career (and close to that of Terrell Owens's 15 years) compared to Moss's more modest, yet not short 14 years, to pad his stats with. Again, Rice deserves credit for remaining productive for so long, but let's not pretend that guys like Moss couldn't have put up sinilar stats had they hung around on (mostly) decent teams like Rice did with San Fran and early 2000's Oakland towards the end of his career. Basically, bearing all this in mind, I don't think Rice's insane stats alone make him the undisputed GOAT.

QBs - Moss had far worse QB play for his career than Rice did, and this isn't even debatable. Moss had 2 1/2 years of Tom Brady and 1 year of an ancient Randall Cunningham, with the rest of his career consisting mainly of scrubs, overrated (Culpepper, who was never anything without Moss), and washed up QBs. Rice on the other hand, had the luxury of having Joe Manontana and prime Steve Young for the vast majority of his career, and prime Rich Gannon in Oakland towards the end. A side note to this - Moss was forced to waste 2 years of his peime in Oakland when the whole team was a dumpster fire, and played on 3 different teams due to trades in 2012, severely hindering his production that year.



So... based on all that. My list of the GOAT WRs -
1 - Randy Moss
2 - Jerry Rice
3 - Terrell Owens

What do you guys think?



I agree with everything you said aside from your top 3.

1. Randy Moss
2. Jerry Rice
3. Don Hutson
 

Ojb81

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Randy Moss is definitely a top-3 all-timer
 

broncosmitty

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I remember how much I miss @Tpaulus2's crazy homer shit on the Lions board.
 

femurov

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He was the most talented and the best athlete, but Rice was the better football player. Rice worked harder than anyone and was a team leader. Moss may not have been the whole problem in Oakland, but he was pouring gas on that dumpster fire. He took plays off being frustrated with the offense. I don't blame him necessarily. I compare his time in Oakland almost like he was in prison.
 

Nosferatu

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Who the fuck is facepalmin me on the Vikes board you summbitch!
 

GhostOfPoverty

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I remember how much I miss @Tpaulus2's crazy homer shit on the Lions board.

Dude.. I'm the same guy who argued on behalf of favoring your beloved Barry Sanders over AP with you on the thread about AP's status among the GOAT RBs. That was the exact same thread where you argued with Nos about the exact same topic... yet you still call ME a homer for making a case for Moss as the #1 WR with Jerry Rice as a very close #2? Moss isn't even as bona fide of a Viking (spent half his career elsewhere) as AD is, or as Barry was a Lion. Lmao, c'mon man.
 

broncosmitty

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Dude.. I'm the same guy who argued on behalf of favoring your beloved Barry Sanders over AP with you on the thread about AP's status among the GOAT RBs. That was the exact same thread where you argued with Nos about the exact same topic... yet you still call ME a homer for making a case for Moss as the #1 WR with Jerry Rice as a very close #2? Lmao, c'mon man.
Rice is so far ahead of everyone it isn't funny.

There are several RBs that could be listed ahead of Sanders. None of em split a backfield with Mark Ingram.
 

GhostOfPoverty

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Scared defenses more

Moss > Rice

Another very good point that people overlook. Randy Moss single handedly set the tone to change the NFL in a way that turned the entire direction of the league into being as pass happy as it is today. To this day, no WR has ever come out who even matched, let alone bested the freakish talent of prime Randy Moss. Did Rice scare defenses? Sure. But the entire league changed the way they played defense to account for Moss.

Moss was consistently double covered for several years of his career for a reason. Just look at the countless plays where he burns upwards of triple - quadruple coverage, or flies past entire defenses for a huge gain or TD. Rice was amazing, but he didn't have the same impact on the game as Moss did.
 

GhostOfPoverty

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Rice is so far ahead of everyone it isn't funny.

There are several RBs that could be listed ahead of Sanders. None of em split a backfield with Mark Ingram.

AP is a 32 year old RB with multiple season ending knee injuries under belt, and you're surprised he will now be relegated to being a role player at this stage in his career? That's like sh!tting on Rice for his limited production in that final season he had in Seattle like it was any reflection on the rest of his great career. Flawed logic at best.

Back to Moss vs Rice, though. I dropped a lot of reasonable facts to support my argument for Moss, and said I can respect people who pick Rice as their #1. But saying Rice was "way beyond" Moss is just ignorant, for the very reasons I listed above. Moss was a lazy bastard with a dogchit attitude for much of his career and got the shaft a number of times with the teams he played for, yet was still very comparable to Rice's first 14 years (vs Moss's 14 year career). Again, longevity counts for something, and I give Rice credit for it. But Moss was as a long-lasting talent in his own right, and Rice's insane 21 years in the league is no different than Emmit Smith hanging around for 15 years to pad his RB records.
 

Nosferatu

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Rice is so far ahead of everyone it isn't funny.

There are several RBs that could be listed ahead of Sanders. None of em split a backfield with Mark Ingram.


It really depends on how you look at it, was Rice the perfect receiver in the fact he ran great routes, keep himself in great shape and was never really a distraction, oh yeah. But he's miles behind Moss when it comes to being able to beat teams on his own, the Packers drafted 3 defensive backs with their first three picks in 1999 because of Moss, teams never did that for Rice. Moss is the most explosive player the NFL has ever seen and it's honestly not that close.

lolzzz on the 2nd comment!
 

Nosferatu

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Rice>>>>>>>2nd place


Hey Cindy, you just gonna say Rice>>>errbody else or you gonna bring something of value to the conversation? You really stupid enough to deny Moss scared D Coordinators more than any receiver ever?
 

jon2tanman

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Hey Cindy, you just gonna say Rice>>>errbody else or you gonna bring something of value to the conversation? You really stupid enough to deny Moss scared D Coordinators more than any receiver ever?
Percy Harvin scared coordinators, so does that make him one of the greatest? I just figured the stats and rings would do the talking, however thanks for the insults.
 

Nosferatu

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Percy Harvin scared coordinators, so does that make him one of the greatest? I just figured the stats and rings would do the talking, however thanks for the insults.


Where did I insult you? You come here say nothing and throw out facepalms, you just don't get it and thats ok and lol at stats and rings making a player the GOAT... So Emmitt is the best RB of all time? Brad Johnson is better than Dan Marino?
 

Nosferatu

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@jon1tanman


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