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The NBA rookies Thread

Mecca

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1984 and 2003 definitely are the gold standard.

93 is interesting but it is hard for me to remember the players immediate impact.

Webber and Penny were immediate impact guys. Not sure how much of an impact Mashburn, Cassell, or Baker had as rookies.
Cassell played a meaningful role in Houston's Championship during his rookie year.

Mashburn put up 19 ppg. But, they only won like 12-15 games I believe.
 

knowyourenemy

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Translation = "Why aren't we talking about Simmons 24/7?"

I'd hardly call Ball a disappointment.

Actually, it’s less “let’s talk Simmons” and more “I don’t want to talk about Fultz.”
 

LogicMan

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Ben Simmons has my vote for ROY.
 

flyerhawk

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This thread has become pretty quiet.

So a Fultz update. Apparently he's shooting 3s in front of the media.


Pretty low shot still but moving in the right direction.
 

wildturkey

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See you in October, buddy!

See him on another team. He'll get traded for veteran help to support Lebron when he signs with the Sixers this summer
 

flyerhawk

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See him on another team. He'll get traded for veteran help to support Lebron when he signs with the Sixers this summer

That seems like an almost impossible move unless the Sixers front office thinks that he is irredeemable.

Dumping your 1st round pick from the year before is a quick way for a GM to get fired.
 
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Sparhawk

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That seems like an almost impossible move unless the Sixers front office thinks that he is irredeemable.

Dumping your 1st round pick from the year before is a quick way for a GM to get fired.

Pretty sure it was tongue in cheek, though I'd have to consider sacrificing Fultz if it meant getting rid of Colangelo....
 

flyerhawk

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Pretty sure it was tongue in cheek, though I'd have to consider sacrificing Fultz if it meant getting rid of Colangelo....

I know that Colangelo comes with his own baggage but I really can't say that I have disagreed with anything he's done since coming to Philly.

Maybe he should not have traded up to No. 1 but, IMO, there was a huge difference between Fultz and Ball as far as style of play is concerned and Ball would have been a very poor fit for the Sixers. So if they roll the dice and see if the Lakers go with Fultz instead, it puts them in a difficult position. From a pure skill set perspective, Fultz was the ideal pick.
 

Sparhawk

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I know that Colangelo comes with his own baggage but I really can't say that I have disagreed with anything he's done since coming to Philly.

Maybe he should not have traded up to No. 1 but, IMO, there was a huge difference between Fultz and Ball as far as style of play is concerned and Ball would have been a very poor fit for the Sixers. So if they roll the dice and see if the Lakers go with Fultz instead, it puts them in a difficult position. From a pure skill set perspective, Fultz was the ideal pick.

Oh, I agree.
I like the Fultz trade and still do.

Got minimal value for Okafor and Stauskas (two high lottery picks, but they suck).
Sold 2nd rounders instead of trying to acquire future 2nds.
Didn't do enough to secure the bench, as we had to add Belli and Ersan this year.
Still not sure about the Pasceznik (sp?) pick.

Every team grumbles about their GM.
This just felt forced after the Hinkie departure and I probably still have sour grapes about that.
 

trojanfan12

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Maybe he should not have traded up to No. 1 but, IMO, there was a huge difference between Fultz and Ball as far as style of play is concerned and Ball would have been a very poor fit for the Sixers. So if they roll the dice and see if the Lakers go with Fultz instead, it puts them in a difficult position. From a pure skill set perspective, Fultz was the ideal pick.

Yeah, that's the thing that folks sometimes forget about when talking about where a guy is drafted. For what the Lakers are trying to do and what they already had, Ball was the better fit for them. They already had scorers, they needed a facilitator.

The Sixers, on the other hand, already had their facilitator in Simmons and needed another scorer, which Fultz appeared to be.

Hopefully, Fultz is getting past whatever his issues have been and we'll get to see what he can do on the court next season.

Pretty sure the Lakers were always going to take Ball, but if you're the Sixers and you think Fultz is the right fit, why take a chance at not getting him?
 

flyerhawk

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Yeah, that's the thing that folks sometimes forget about when talking about where a guy is drafted. For what the Lakers are trying to do and what they already had, Ball was the better fit for them. They already had scorers, they needed a facilitator.

The Sixers, on the other hand, already had their facilitator in Simmons and needed another scorer, which Fultz appeared to be.

Hopefully, Fultz is getting past whatever his issues have been and we'll get to see what he can do on the court next season.

Pretty sure the Lakers were always going to take Ball, but if you're the Sixers and you think Fultz is the right fit, why take a chance at not getting him?

Exactly. It's also not just the Lakers that they need to worry about. It's some other team trading with the Celtics to get the No. 1 pick.

I actually looked at the Lakers as a team that could go either way with Fultz or Ball and it would have made sense to me. They may have had Ball as their clear No. 1 the whole time and that would make sense. But they could have also said "Fultz is 1A and Ball is 1B" and that would make sense. Their roster was a little more flexible in that regard.

For the Sixers, Ball simply made no sense given that they planned to have Simmons run point. Ball MUST be the primary ball handler on a team to be a big impact.
 

flyerhawk

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Oh, I agree.
I like the Fultz trade and still do.

Got minimal value for Okafor and Stauskas (two high lottery picks, but they suck).
Sold 2nd rounders instead of trying to acquire future 2nds.
Didn't do enough to secure the bench, as we had to add Belli and Ersan this year.
Still not sure about the Pasceznik (sp?) pick.

Every team grumbles about their GM.
This just felt forced after the Hinkie departure and I probably still have sour grapes about that.

Fair enough. I thought that Hinkie got a raw deal and wasn't thrilled that they brought in Colangelo.

But honestly he hasn't done anything that I can get too worked up over. The Bolden and Korkmaz picks could turn into real diamonds in the rough. Sure I would have liked to see us get more for Stauskas and Okafor but Stauskas is still paying us dividends as part of the Kings pick and Okafor is simply not a modern NBA player.

Getting more bench depth would have been good but honestly, this wasn't the year I was worried about that. And I didn't want anything that would bind our cap down the road.
 

tlance

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That seems like an almost impossible move unless the Sixers front office thinks that he is irredeemable.

Dumping your 1st round pick from the year before is a quick way for a GM to get fired.

Not so sure.

Fultz still has plenty of value. Not as much as a 1 overall pick would normally have, but he has a lot of upside.

What if they can swing a deal like this:

Saric, Fultz + best remaining 1st for Kawhi Leonard

This is just hypothetical, but If things are really beyond repair in SA between Kawhi and the organization, something like this could be possible. The point is that Fultz could be part of a package to get an established star. The 6ers still have the assets to get another really good player without dealing Simmons or Embiid. A move like that wouldn't be giving up on Fultz.
 

flyerhawk

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Not so sure.

Fultz still has plenty of value. Not as much as a 1 overall pick would normally have, but he has a lot of upside.

What if they can swing a deal like this:

Saric, Fultz + best remaining 1st for Kawhi Leonard

This is just hypothetical, but If things are really beyond repair in SA between Kawhi and the organization, something like this could be possible. The point is that Fultz could be part of a package to get an established star. The 6ers still have the assets to get another really good player without dealing Simmons or Embiid. A move like that wouldn't be giving up on Fultz.

OK, sure. I don't think that is terribly likely but if they could get a star in return for Fultz and some others then that would work. I just don't think that is possible barring a weird Kyrie Irving type situation and a GM really more or less ignoring Fultz's weird year.
 

shopson67

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Fultz 6'4" or 6'5" depending on who you listen to. I can think of more than a few 2 guards that excelled at that height.

Yeah, I guess he just seems shorter (maybe just because we haven't seen him enough?). Listed at 6'4, 195, so he's shorter but thicker/stronger than Ball.
 

shopson67

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Not so sure.

Fultz still has plenty of value. Not as much as a 1 overall pick would normally have, but he has a lot of upside.

What if they can swing a deal like this:

Saric, Fultz + best remaining 1st for Kawhi Leonard

This is just hypothetical, but If things are really beyond repair in SA between Kawhi and the organization, something like this could be possible. The point is that Fultz could be part of a package to get an established star. The 6ers still have the assets to get another really good player without dealing Simmons or Embiid. A move like that wouldn't be giving up on Fultz.

I don't think Kawhi is going anywhere personally. Plus, if the Spurs were ready to move him, I would be a little concerned about what I was getting.
 

flyerhawk

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Yeah, I guess he just seems shorter (maybe just because we haven't seen him enough?). Listed at 6'4, 195, so he's shorter but thicker/stronger than Ball.

And, truth be told, the Sixers are not exactly a team lacking in height. If he were the 2 the starting 5 for the Sixers would be 7'1", 6'10",6'10", 6'9", 6'4". And Fultz has a 7' wingspan. IMO, that was actually one of the reasons why teams liked him so much.
 

flyerhawk

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I don't think Kawhi is going anywhere personally. Plus, if the Spurs were ready to move him, I would be a little concerned about what I was getting.

Agree with this. This is probably the lowest trade value that Kawhi will ever have. If they are willing to deal him, then something wrong.

Unless he's the first player I can think of who simply can't play for Pop ever.
 

shopson67

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How are you defining 'undersized'?
Just by height?
Are you taking into account wingspan?

Is Draymond an undersized C?

Of course Draymond is undersized for a center. He's technically undersized for a power forward historically. 6'7, 230 lbs, and he's listed as a SF/PF.

Fultz seems undersized since I only see him sitting down in a suit... :heh:

Why are we spending so much time talking about Ball and Fultz? There are so many rookies having great seasons. Why focus on the disappointments?

Sixers fans keep bringing up Fultz; he's been largely out of sight, out of mind since he hasn't been playing. Nothing disappointing about Ball (other than the time he has missed to injury and his family's distractions).
 
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