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The NBA rookies Thread

Discussion in 'NBA Basketball Forum' started by handicappers, Oct 20, 2017.

  1. Gman

    Gman Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, sure... that being said: the more hokey the form the worse % a guy shoots, generally speaking.
    A free throw is all 1.) form and 2.) repetition, though... why would anyone ever train with a certain form and plan to change that form in the near future?
     



  2. tlance

    tlance Kyrie Hater

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    Not bad actually.

    In the video, he is shooting from the center of his body, which certainly isn't textbook but it isn't Lonzo Ball bad.

    In the preseason, his shooting form looked completely disjointed. That stroke looks fluid. I think you may see a different player when he returns.
     
  3. tlance

    tlance Kyrie Hater

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    His release is okay. Much better than it looked in November.

    The biggest issue I see is that he isn't using his lower body really at all. The center of body release isn't the worst as long as he can get space to get his shot off.
     
  4. flyerhawk

    flyerhawk Well-Known Member

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    Yeah definitely not Lonzo level weird. But definitely not textbook.

    Watching his form at Washington would actually suggest it has improved a bit in form..



    That little tippy toe action definitely isn't something you want to see.

    Free throws are all about repeatable muscle memory. So I don't really care too much about about pretty or ugly it is if he is hitting them. But it would be preferable to see a clean form.

    I would be very surprised if he doesn't look VASTLY different when he comes back. There was clearly something wrong with him that was effecting his mechanics. It will likely take some time for him to get into form but I would be shocked if we see anything close to the ugliness of those early games.
     
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  5. Gman

    Gman Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that's what I see too.

    An all arms motion just isn't as smooth (or as likely to produce satisfactory results) as a free throw motion in which the legs do their fair share.
     
  6. Mecca

    Mecca Masochistic Fan of habitual shit show

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    Comfortably?

    No.

    The 76ers are only 3 games better and Mitchell has taken the rookie scoring lead.

    As evidenced by MCW ROY win, Team accomplishments aren't the determining factor.

    If the vote went down today, 50/50 chance that Mitchell would win.

    Midseason NBA Rookie of the Year Rankings: Simmons holds slim lead

    Dose: Real Rookies for ROY
     
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  7. Mecca

    Mecca Masochistic Fan of habitual shit show

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  8. flyerhawk

    flyerhawk Well-Known Member

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    Not familiar with TPA but it looks like some sort of logarithmic adjustment to BPM.

    Here a tabular format of the data.

    2017-18 NBA TPA | NBA Math

    I didn't realize that Simmons had a negative OBPM. I'm guessing the turnovers really drag that down. I also didn't realize how dominant he has been defensively. He's the 3rd highest rated player defensively in the league based on these stats.
     
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  9. LogicMan

    LogicMan The green machine is about to wreak havoc

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    I still am surprised how Fultz and Ball's poor shooting was not picked up on in pre draft workouts. I think there is so much hype in this league. But their are gems that were not pre year ROY favorites and in time they will continue to rise to the top. Its Mitchells IMO to lose but Simmons early lead will be tough to overcome
     
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  10. bksballer89

    bksballer89 Most Popular Member

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    Show my man Bam some love.

    16-15-5 tonight. Not many rookies put up those numbers.
     
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  11. wildturkey

    wildturkey Well-Known Member

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    Fultz played hurt in the few games he did play so you can't really make any judgements on that. The people that really know what they're watching and talking about did pick up on Ball's shooting beforehand though. His lone season at UCLA numbers were inflated off wide open system based lay ups and wide open threes. His numbers dropped quite a bit on the road and he also never had good shooting numbers in competitions pre-college. The red flags were there if you drilled down past the box score stats. Combine that with that funky ass motion and most true experts expected some struggles. The real question was if it was fixable and if not, just how effective of a player can he be in the modern NBA where so much of a PG's value is dependent on how he can score.
     
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  12. ChiefsLakers67

    ChiefsLakers67 Cowards WILL BE cowards..

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    that pick's a helluva lot better than most folks thought...
     
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  13. bksballer89

    bksballer89 Most Popular Member

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    Yep and he's only going to get better. Raw on offense. I expect a much better offensive version of him next year after he work on his game in the summer. His defense is amazing though. Can basically guard any position
     
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  14. flyerhawk

    flyerhawk Well-Known Member

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    Ben Simmons is currently 4th in voting for guard in the Eastern Conference.

    Mitchell can definitely win it but he will need to continue to play really well and Simmons will need to play more like the Simmons of 2 weeks ago than the Simmons of the rest of the season.
     
  15. bksballer89

    bksballer89 Most Popular Member

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    So lol. Not exactly relevant. Fans don't vote on the ROY.
     
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  16. flyerhawk

    flyerhawk Well-Known Member

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    Of course it is relevant. They don't vote on the ROY because they are a good reflection of what general consensus is. Simmons is consistently called one of the best players in the LEAGUE right now.

    That may change. Simmons may fade. Mitchell or Tatum or someone else may step up even further. But Simmons has been an all around high quality player despite not shooting from the outside.

    In all honesty, Simmons is likely in the running for NBA defensive team.

    To be clear, it is ultimately irrelevant who wins the ROY. It's fun to chat about but it doesn't really matter. So I'm fine with anyone winning the award despite having a bias for Ben.
     
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  17. Mecca

    Mecca Masochistic Fan of habitual shit show

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    The All star vote is a popularity contest.

    If merit based awards are given based on fan votes, Kobe and Shaq would have another MVP trophy and Steve Nash would have none.

    Ditto for Barkley and Karl Malone.

    * see Michael Jordan

    Nothing against Simmons because he is absolutely fabulous.

    But, if he is the next Lebron, Mitchell is most certainly the next Westbrook.
     
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  18. trojanfan12

    trojanfan12 R.I.P. Robotic Dreams. Fight On!

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    Can't speak to Fultz, but Lonzo was hitting those shots during his season at UCLA. I've also heard that he hit them in his workouts and hits them in practice. For whatever reason, it hasn't translated to actual games yet.

    Although, his shooting has improved of late. I still think he needs to, at least, change his release point. But he hasn't been as bad as he was earlier in the season.
     
  19. Mecca

    Mecca Masochistic Fan of habitual shit show

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    Ben is one of the better players, despite the jumper shortcomings.

    Dude is a flat out stud.

    Size, Speed, Vision, Unselfishness...It's almost unfair.

    Donovan had a rocky start.

    But, he has come on with a vengance.

    Not only does he lead all Rookies in scoring, he's 4th in the NBA in 4th quarter scoring.

    There are no wrong answers here.

    Both guys and Tatum are legit candidates.
     
  20. flyerhawk

    flyerhawk Well-Known Member

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    All these awards are popularity contests.

    Was Russell Westbrook really the MVP last year? From a pure basketball sense, no. Lebron was the MVP. But the voters base their vote on other factors.

    Regardless of whether Simmons should or should not be an all-star, he is a rookie who is likely to be an all-star. There have only been 3 rookies to make an all start team in the last 20 years. Griffin, Yao Ming, and Tim Duncan.

    Now,granted, this is one of the strongest rookie classes in a very long time. So it is far from certain that Simmons will win RoY. But being an All Star will certainly help.
     
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