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Redskins' Kirk Cousins: Still far apart on extension terms

gkekoa

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Who says we will have to pay $35 million? That is the peak of the roof...not the ceiling. Only way i see him getting that kind of money from us or anyone else (if we transition him is)...

A) We go deep into the playoffs and he asserts himself as one of the Top few QBs in the game. As I think someone else said, other players could restructure to continue playing for a winner.

B) He goes to a crappy team with crappy players with tons of cap space.

And if he takes us deep, we aren't going to be worried about losing Breeland, Lauvao, some of those guys.

Further more, If he signed with us (LTD or through the TT), wouldn't that spread the cap hit out? You guys are assuming we FT him again and have a cap hit of 35 mill??

Follow the thread. I was talking to dad because he could be paid that on the transition tag by SF so we can't match it. Dad said we could match it because we had 59 million in cap space. I said we can't.
 

gkekoa

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Case in point:

RIGHT NOW, without any of these players playing a single down for the redskins in 2017, how many of these 2018 free agents are ones the redskins MUST RESIGN NOW!!!

Kirk Cousins- Absolutely!

Terrell Pryor- Who knows, really? You could say yes considering previous success with crappy qb play in Cleveland, but that doesn't mean that Pryor will be awesome here?

Shaun Lauvao- No.

Zachary Brown- No. Not yet at least.

Mason Foster - No.

Will Compton - No, though the Redskins can't get rid of all three ILB's without a conceivable back up plan.

Breeland - Playing on borrowed time. Drafted Fuller last year, two guys this year.

Long - Put up or shut up year. So, as of right now, no.

Murphy - As of right now, no.

Those are our top three ILBs. We will sign at least one of them to a contract. Even if we don't sign these guys at ILB, they have to be replaced, and there really aren't cheaper options.

Whether it is Pryor, or somebody else, we would have to replace that top tier WR.

Lauvao, totally expendable. I agree. Replacements are on the team.

Breeland will need to be resigned if he has a good year. Just because you draft people, especially a seventh rounder, doesn't mean they can replace the veteran. Fuller has proven nothing, Moreau even less.

Long is a quality starter. Again, even if you don't sign him, he has to be replaced. We can't replace him without any quality without spending money.

Murphy would still need to be replaced. There are no cheaper options.


This is the problem our FO has. We do not extend guys with a year left on their contract. When you do, you get bargains. We should have tried to extend Long last season because he hadn't proven his true worth but proved he was at worst solid.
 

gkekoa

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Case in point:

RIGHT NOW, without any of these players playing a single down for the redskins in 2017, how many of these 2018 free agents are ones the redskins MUST RESIGN NOW!!!

Kirk Cousins- Absolutely!

Terrell Pryor- Who knows, really? You could say yes considering previous success with crappy qb play in Cleveland, but that doesn't mean that Pryor will be awesome here?

Shaun Lauvao- No.

Zachary Brown- No. Not yet at least.

Mason Foster - No.

Will Compton - No, though the Redskins can't get rid of all three ILB's without a conceivable back up plan.

Breeland - Playing on borrowed time. Drafted Fuller last year, two guys this year.

Long - Put up or shut up year. So, as of right now, no.

Murphy - As of right now, no.

Those are our top three ILBs. We will sign at least one of them to a contract. Even if we don't sign these guys at ILB, they have to be replaced, and there really aren't cheaper options.

Whether it is Pryor, or somebody else, we would have to replace that top tier WR.

Lauvao, totally expendable. I agree. Replacements are on the team.

Breeland will need to be resigned if he has a good year. Just because you draft people, especially a seventh rounder, doesn't mean they can replace the veteran. Fuller has proven nothing, Moreau even less.

Long is a quality starter. Again, even if you don't sign him, he has to be replaced. We can't replace him without any quality without spending money.

Murphy would still need to be replaced. There are no cheaper options.


This is the problem our FO has. We do not extend guys with a year left on their contract. When you do, you get bargains. We should have tried to extend Long last season because he hadn't proven his true worth but proved he was at worst solid.
 

j_y19

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Case in point:

RIGHT NOW, without any of these players playing a single down for the redskins in 2017, how many of these 2018 free agents are ones the redskins MUST RESIGN NOW!!!

Kirk Cousins- Absolutely!

Terrell Pryor- Who knows, really? You could say yes considering previous success with crappy qb play in Cleveland, but that doesn't mean that Pryor will be awesome here?

Shaun Lauvao- No.

Zachary Brown- No. Not yet at least.

Mason Foster - No.

Will Compton - No, though the Redskins can't get rid of all three ILB's without a conceivable back up plan.

Breeland - Playing on borrowed time. Drafted Fuller last year, two guys this year.

Long - Put up or shut up year. So, as of right now, no.

Murphy - As of right now, no.
You just let our entire ILB corps walk away. Not too smart.

Long is probably a must signing, but he should be fairly cheap. He is our starting center and just coming into his prime. Kinda am important position, wouldn't ya think?
 

skinsdad62

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FAs for 2018

Kirk Cousins- 24

Terrell Pryor- 6

Shaun Lauvao- 5

Zachary Brown- 2.5

Mason Foster

Will Compton

Breeland

Long

Murphy


So...who do you resign? KC, Pryor, Breeland, and Long will not be cheap and eat up all of that space, especially if KC is taking up 35 mil of it trying to equal a contract of SF.

As for looking at what the NYJ did to free space, they got rid of everybody not named Wilkerson or is on their rookie contract.

pryor would be a must , brown could be too , BB had his replacement drafted (moraeu ) TM might be gone too with anderson pick , roullier could replace lavou (or kujo if he shows ) long wont be expensive , foster wont either but if he is draft one as is compton

nothing that cant be overcome and we havent restructured anyone
 

Niner Outlaw

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Seems like both sides might be content with going forward on the tag. IF we transition him next year, he gets an offer sheet and we match or exceed that...is he forced to sign with us?
Yes. The Skins transition tag him in 2018. Even if KC signs the transition tag immediately, if KC signs an offer sheet from another team, and the Skins match it, it's the same as KC signing that same contract with the Skins.

However, as @Sharkinva points out, if KC signs the transition tag, he could decide to NOT sign any other team's offer sheet and he would play the 2018 season with the skins, making a guaranteed 28M salary.

Who says we will have to pay $35 million? That is the peak of the roof...not the ceiling. Only way i see him getting that kind of money from us or anyone else (if we transition him is)...

A) We go deep into the playoffs and he asserts himself as one of the Top few QBs in the game. As I think someone else said, other players could restructure to continue playing for a winner.
B) He goes to a crappy team with crappy players with tons of cap space.

And if he takes us deep, we aren't going to be worried about losing Breeland, Lauvao, some of those guys. Further more, If he signed with us (LTD or through the TT), wouldn't that spread the cap hit out? You guys are assuming we FT him again and have a cap hit of 35 mill??

In post 41, @gkekoa was asking if the Skins would/could match another team's front loaded offer of a 5yr, 130M offer that had Cousins making 35M in each of the first 2 seasons. If the Skins matched that, the 35M would not be spread out b/c it would be salary—under that offer, KC would take up 35M in cap space in both 2018 and 2019. If KC gets the TT, any offer he gets from another team will have VERY high cap numbers for the first year or 2.

I find it amusing that some folks here believe that he only way Cousins warrants a LTD is to either make the SB or come very, very close. Ridiculous.
I agree. If the Skins won't pay him the deal he wants this year, what makes anyone think that they'll pay him what he wants after a deep playoff run...since his demands will GO WAY UP. It seems like the last 2 years, the FO has been willing to pay him what he wanted the previous year. Fans saying that the team will offer him the Luck deal or better if he has a great year this year are falling in that same trap...b/c that is what he wants now. Next year, he'll want much more.
 

skinsdad62

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Fastbreak with C-Mills: Daniel Ochefu and Kris Jenkins
It seems like Monday's franchise tag deadline will come and go without much news between Kirk Cousins and the Redskins. The quarterback is currently slated to play on a one-year, $24 million deal in 2017, and unless a contract breakthrough takes place over the weekend, that looks to be the plan for this season.

The intrigue then all begins again in 2018.

Washington will have three options with Cousins then:

  1. Make a deal - Get a new contract signed in the time after the season ends and before the team must decide to use another tag, either franchise or transition.
  2. Tag you're it - The team can again tag Cousins, for a third straight season. The transition tag carries a $28 million price tag and lets the QB market his services around the league, which the Redskins can then match. Another franchise tag would cost $34 million, and Cousins' options for talking with other teams are either non-existent or much more limited than the transition tag. Not to mention, $34 million guaranteed for one season is unheard of, it's hard to imagine a scenario where that money gets turned down.
  3. So long - The final option in 2018 is Cousins hits free agency unfettered and can go to the team of his choice. This seems the least likely option, but the entirety of the Cousins contract saga has been bizarre so who knows what will happen.
It is important to note, however, that the Redskins will have plenty of cap room in 2018. $54 million to be exact. That much money would allow them to match just about any offer that might come for Cousins should he be given the transition tag.

ROSTER BATTLES: Left guard | Tight end | Nickel cornerback | Inside linebacker | Running back

One report suggested that two NFL general managers are prepared to front-load offers for Cousins in 2018 to make it hard for the Redskins to match.

Immense speculation points to the 49ers wanting Cousins, especially given the ties between new coach Kyle Shanahan and the Washington quarterback. San Francsico projects to be about $50 million under the 2018 salary cap, meaning they actually have less available money than the Redskins. Those figures can change, and San Francisco could have a lot of money roll over from the 2017 cap.

For Redskins fans worried about the 49ers spending recklessly to sign Cousins, know that the actual cap numbers might not support the theory. Would the Niners pay Cousins as much as the franchise tag in 2018? Maybe, but that's a prohibitive figure.

Realize too, however, that Washington has now had two offseasons to try and work out a multi-year deal with Cousins. It hasn't happened, and hasn't really even appeared close to happening.

It's entirely possible that should Cousins find a major dollar offer next year in free agency, the Redskins won't match it. That doesn't mean they can't.

there are some cap figures
 

BeaReylo

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List of Washington Redskins starting quarterbacks - Wikipedia

I would throw out the names RG3, Campbell, Ramsey & Shuler - QBs the Skins drafted in the 1st rd. How about QBs that they acquired via trades/free agency - Grossman, Beck, McNabb, Brunell, Banks, George, etc. Save for a very short period of time for certain QBs Cousins is the only Redskins QB that has done anything for this team in the last 20 years.

Take a look at the history of the Redskins QBs in the link above - pretty depressing. Sure Cousins has his flaws but nowhere near to the degree of the other QBs. To expect this team to find another even serviceable QB (especially w/ their dysfunctional organization) is just plain stupid (not saying it can't happen - but the odds are not in their favor).

I find it amusing that some folks here believe that he only way Cousins warrants a LTD is to either make the SB or come very, very close. Ridiculous. What if say they make the playoffs & lose in the 1st rd & Cousins has a stellar (pro bowl) season & most of the losses are not due to him? You can't simply paint these black & white situations about whether to pay him or not and you can't eliminate the element of risk for all of this. Let's hope that they settle this by Mon. HTTR.

Yep, when I started watching football Heath Schuler and Gus Ferrotte were The Redskins QBs. And it hasn't gotten any better save for a few sparse seasons. I don't know where the Cousins must go crowd thinks Washington will find a better option because he's been the best QB here since I've been watching The B&G?
 

Skin'EmAll

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List of Washington Redskins starting quarterbacks - Wikipedia

I would throw out the names RG3, Campbell, Ramsey & Shuler - QBs the Skins drafted in the 1st rd. How about QBs that they acquired via trades/free agency - Grossman, Beck, McNabb, Brunell, Banks, George, etc. Save for a very short period of time for certain QBs Cousins is the only Redskins QB that has done anything for this team in the last 20 years.

Take a look at the history of the Redskins QBs in the link above - pretty depressing. Sure Cousins has his flaws but nowhere near to the degree of the other QBs. To expect this team to find another even serviceable QB (especially w/ their dysfunctional organization) is just plain stupid (not saying it can't happen - but the odds are not in their favor).

I find it amusing that some folks here believe that he only way Cousins warrants a LTD is to either make the SB or come very, very close. Ridiculous. What if say they make the playoffs & lose in the 1st rd & Cousins has a stellar (pro bowl) season & most of the losses are not due to him? You can't simply paint these black & white situations about whether to pay him or not and you can't eliminate the element of risk for all of this. Let's hope that they settle this by Mon. HTTR.

Wow, the evidence and history is pathetic. I do believe at this point the FO knows they screwed up but just
can't allow what they consider a low level afterthought to now have the leverage. I think they are going to end
up reaching on a QB or paying 20per to Garp or AJ maybe???

some options next year if they can't get the deal done...

Jake Browning*, QB, Washington, Luke Falk, QB, Washington State, Josh Rosen*, QB, UCLA
Lamar Jackson*, QB, Louisville, Josh Allen*, QB, Wyoming, Sam Darnold**, QB, USC
Bridgewater, Bradford, Garoppolo, AJ McCarron(RFA)
 

countryroads316

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Josh Allen is at the top of my list then Sam Darnold as for the rest no thanks
 

Sharkinva

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Josh Allen is at the top of my list then Sam Darnold as for the rest no thanks


Washington has got to be the first team in history even contemplating replacing our 29 year old franchise leading QB with a rookie, over ego and money.
 

skinsdad62

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i want to see more of jake browning . he could be interesting hopefully he isnt a jake locker clone
 

SoCalWizFan

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i want to see more of jake browning . he could be interesting hopefully he isnt a jake locker clone

Therein lies the rub. How in the hell does anyone know if any of these guys will have even moderate success in the NFL. Heck - even if they have a good/great rookie year it is no guarantee of success beyond that (as all Redskins fans should know).

Even w/his flaws Cousins seems a better bet then just about anyone they could get (save perhaps a Darnold but they would likely have to trade the farm to get him - pass). I love how some folks want to have Cousins play on the tag another year to reduce risk yet completely ignore the risk that would be involved in finding another QB. Just very flawed logic IMO.
 

skinsdad62

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Therein lies the rub. How in the hell does anyone know if any of these guys will have even moderate success in the NFL. Heck - even if they have a good/great rookie year it is no guarantee of success beyond that (as all Redskins fans should know).

Even w/his flaws Cousins seems a better bet then just about anyone they could get (save perhaps a Darnold but they would likely have to trade the farm to get him - pass). I love how some folks want to have Cousins play on the tag another year to reduce risk yet completely ignore the risk that would be involved in finding another QB. Just very flawed logic IMO.
yep the best thing for this team is to sign him to a LTD
 

skinsdad62

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Florio: "Per a source with knowledge of the situation, internal disagreement exists within the organiz/ regarding Cousins' actual value."

for what its worth and the infamous un named source
 

Sharkinva

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yep the best thing for this team is to sign him to a LTD


I dont know man. We havent even started training camp, and people are already making their "I hope we can draft (insert QB here) posts off and on.

You would think we were a 4-14 team starting a QB that had just failed miserably and was trying to come back off of injury or something with the way some have totally written off our current QB and to an extent the season in hopes of drafting the next elite rookie QB.
 

skinsdad62

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Cousins has been a Redskin for five years and 41 starts. Team still does not have consensus on his value. But nah, they don't need a GM.

the FO is manure
 

chillerdab

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Those are our top three ILBs. We will sign at least one of them to a contract. Even if we don't sign these guys at ILB, they have to be replaced, and there really aren't cheaper options.

Whether it is Pryor, or somebody else, we would have to replace that top tier WR.

Lauvao, totally expendable. I agree. Replacements are on the team.

Breeland will need to be resigned if he has a good year. Just because you draft people, especially a seventh rounder, doesn't mean they can replace the veteran. Fuller has proven nothing, Moreau even less.

Long is a quality starter. Again, even if you don't sign him, he has to be replaced. We can't replace him without any quality without spending money.

Murphy would still need to be replaced. There are no cheaper options.


This is the problem our FO has. We do not extend guys with a year left on their contract. When you do, you get bargains. We should have tried to extend Long last season because he hadn't proven his true worth but proved he was at worst solid.




If you notice, I clearly stated that it would be extremely unlikely for the redskins to not sign at least one of the ILB's, though I do think it's pretty amusing that three of you people missed it.
 

j_y19

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Then it must not have been stated as clearly as you meant.
 
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