ND vs LSU Music City Bowl:

[Lillyliverd]

So many years of solid recruiting and when a player goes down, all we have is freshmen. WTF! Also, why is it that there seems to be only one guy at a time that understands the defense?

 

[Lillyliverd]

It is no wonder our defense sucked so bad. Collinsworth and Schmidt were the only players that understood it.

 

[purguy12]

It is no wonder our defense sucked so bad. Collinsworth and Schmidt were the only players that understood it.

J. Smith would disagree.(3rd team all american)

 

[poewelch84]

So isn't depth part of what makes a team good? And a good team with no depth isn't that good a team for the entire season. You had a walk on running your defense. Doesn't that mean somewhere down the line your coaches either didnt recruit enough players for that unit or they missed on their picks or they didnt coach up what they had? Everyone has injuries and some get more than others. You cant say if every one was healthy then we'd be good because no one is totally healthy. I imagine Northwestern wasn't totally healthy when they played the Irish and I am pretty sure none of their players are supposed to be as good as your players. You had a not so great D line when you started and a not so good secondary ( you gotta admit if austin collingsworth is one of your best you're not that good there). Once injuries happened the drop of to the second guys was huge. You were a middle of the road team this year , obviously not as bad as the team that played USC but no were near top ten no matter that you won your first six games. You had one decent opponent and it was at home. Louisville played FSU tough , Oklahoma State played them tough, NC state played them tough, Miami played them tough, BC played them tough , Florida played them tough. But in all those games they came back and won just like they did with the Irish. . None of those teams turned out any good. The good thing is your young guys got playing time which should help you next couple of years.

I never disputed that Notre Dame was great team, I said that injuries played a role in the outcome against USC, and that your team's freshman had more experience than Notre Dame's freshman that were forced into starting roles due to injuries. I know not recruiting enough or missing could very well be the case but at least two possibly three upperclassmen D-Lineman had their careers ended due to injury one during fall camp or spring ball. They had two players leave for the NFL (Nix and Tuitt) and a player commit and then leave after signing day in Vanderdoes which all hurt the depth at D-Line. They then had two senior MLB get injured and careers likely over at least at Notre Dame possibly for good. Then of course they lost one safety for most of the season, one senior LB, a Starting CB, a D-Lineman and their leading receiver. At safety they lost three players to season ending and one potentially career ending injury (this is the one position I think Kelly has neglected in part because players had been moved to play LB). I don't care what college team you are when you lose as many players from you two deep as that on Defense you can't over come it no matter the depth get a clue SoCal. They lost as many as 10 or 11 from their depth on defense many at LB and Secondary during the season and several on the D-Line before this season and during.

 

[socaljim242]

I never disputed that Notre Dame was great team, I said that injuries played a role in the outcome against USC, and that your team's freshman had more experience than Notre Dame's freshman that were forced into starting roles due to injuries. I know not recruiting enough or missing could very well be the case but at least two possibly three upperclassmen D-Lineman had their careers ended due to injury one during fall camp or spring ball. They had two players leave for the NFL (Nix and Tuitt) and a player commit and then leave after signing day in Vanderdoes which all hurt the depth at D-Line. They then had two senior MLB get injured and careers likely over at least at Notre Dame possibly for good. Then of course they lost one safety for most of the season, one senior LB, a Starting CB, a D-Lineman and their leading receiver. At safety they lost three players to season ending and one potentially career ending injury (this is the one position I think Kelly has neglected in part because players had been moved to play LB). I don't care what college team you are when you lose as many players from you two deep as that on Defense you can't over come it no matter the depth get a clue SoCal. They lost as many as 10 or 11 from their depth on defense many at LB and Secondary during the season and several on the D-Line before this season and during.

Wierd. You won your first six games without Tuitt and Nix but them going to the NFL was one in your long list or excuses for why you lost games?. And Vanderdoes has been gone how long and he's an excuse too? You don't think your starting QB having 22 turnovers might add to a season going downhill? You just weren'ta complete team and your coaches ddidn't help. Same could be said for USC. Bone head player mistakes and bone head coaching lost them games and they weren't good enough to overcome them. I think next year both can be pretty good. I'mgoing to that game so hoping for two highly ranked teams.

 

[poewelch84]

Wierd. You won your first six games without Tuitt and Nix but them going to the NFL was one in your long list or excuses for why you lost games?. And Vanderdoes has been gone how long and he's an excuse too? You don't think your starting QB having 22 turnovers might add to a season going downhill? You just weren'ta complete team and your coaches ddidn't help. Same could be said for USC. Bone head player mistakes and bone head coaching lost them games and they weren't good enough to overcome them. I think next year both can be pretty good. I'mgoing to that game so hoping for two highly ranked teams.

Of course Golson's turnovers played a key part in it. However Tuitt and Nix being their isn't an excuse as much as a reason for their depth much like Vanderdoes to be so young, plus the career ending injuries. It's difficult to replace a guy like Vanderdoes when he leaves after the signing period. The defense was a big issue as big as Golson turning the ball over they allowed over 30 points in each of the last 7 games sure some of that came off turnovers but they could limit the other teams to field goals. Like I said I never said they were a complete team I was giving you a detailed reason as to why their depth was the way it was which made them an incomplete team. It doesn't change the fact that although USC played a lot of younger players they still had an entire season of experience and some two years compared to some guys making their first or second start for Notre Dame. If you can't understand that then that is on you.

 

[Lillyliverd]

It is no wonder our defense sucked so bad. Collinsworth and Schmidt were the only players that understood it.

J. Smith would disagree.(3rd team all american)

Would Smith disagree that our defense sucked? Was Smith the "one" on the field that possessed command of the defense and made sure players were in place and knew their assignment? Was Smith a 3rd team AA selection because of his individual stats or for his great leadership?

I think Smith was 3rd team AA because he had a bunch of tackles and a few sacks. I also think he got his tackles because he is a gifted athlete and he knew one thing; he had to tackle the guy with the football. If you are a great athlete and all you know is "tackle the guy with the football" you will get numbers.

You (Purguy) and Smith may be convinced that Smith's success was due to his mastery of the defense, but I am not.

 

[purguy12]

Would Smith disagree that our defense sucked? Was Smith the "one" on the field that possessed command of the defense and made sure players were in place and knew their assignment? Was Smith a 3rd team AA selection because of his individual stats or for his great leadership?

I think Smith was 3rd team AA because he had a bunch of tackles and a few sacks. I also think he got his tackles because he is a gifted athlete and he knew one thing; he had to tackle the guy with the football. If you are a great athlete and all you know is "tackle the guy with the football" you will get numbers.

You (Purguy) and Smith may be convinced that Smith's success was due to his mastery of the defense, but I am not.

Come on man we were playing with 4-8 freshmen on D. No buddy would be able to lead that unit. Injuries hit this team big time. J. Smith was a beast this year. He always gave it his all. He plays hard and I can respect that.

 

[socaljim242]

Of course Golson's turnovers played a key part in it. However Tuitt and Nix being their isn't an excuse as much as a reason for their depth much like Vanderdoes to be so young, plus the career ending injuries. It's difficult to replace a guy like Vanderdoes when he leaves after the signing period. The defense was a big issue as big as Golson turning the ball over they allowed over 30 points in each of the last 7 games sure some of that came off turnovers but they could limit the other teams to field goals. Like I said I never said they were a complete team I was giving you a detailed reason as to why their depth was the way it was which made them an incomplete team. It doesn't change the fact that although USC played a lot of younger players they still had an entire season of experience and some two years compared to some guys making their first or second start for Notre Dame. If you can't understand that then that is on you.

Still not buying the excuses. If you're an elite program that sends players to the NFL you can't be shocked and not plan when juniors skip their last year and head for the NFL. ND sends as many players as any school out there. So blaming depth because of that is weak especially saying that it was a reason after 6-7 games. USc started three freshmen and a sophomore on the O line , a total of 11 freshmen playing significantly and one going both ways. To say starting the season with a bunch of freshmen and sophmores and having to keep playing them all year because you only have 45-50 scholarship players available is somehow better than having your younger players come in slowly ( your players didnt all go down in one game and some came back) come in after they have had six seven games of practice, doesn't make any sense.
You had a turnover happy QB a defense you knew was going to need the help of the offense and a coach like us who blew at least one game. The injuries just cemented what you were just like SCs last game collapses cemented who they were. Both teams were not top 10 material no matter what.

 

[poewelch84]

Still not buying the excuses. If you're an elite program that sends players to the NFL you can't be shocked and not plan when juniors skip their last year and head for the NFL. ND sends as many players as any school out there. So blaming depth because of that is weak especially saying that it was a reason after 6-7 games. USc started three freshmen and a sophomore on the O line , a total of 11 freshmen playing significantly and one going both ways. To say starting the season with a bunch of freshmen and sophmores and having to keep playing them all year because you only have 45-50 scholarship players available is somehow better than having your younger players come in slowly ( your players didnt all go down in one game and some came back) come in after they have had six seven games of practice, doesn't make any sense.
You had a turnover happy QB a defense you knew was going to need the help of the offense and a coach like us who blew at least one game. The injuries just cemented what you were just like SCs last game collapses cemented who they were. Both teams were not top 10 material no matter what.

Once again I didn't state they were but my point is Socal (and I didn't say it was better so keep putting those words in my mouth) that your freshman and sophmores had more game experience than Notre Dame which does help them more than practice time. Sure you can recruit and replace guys but like I've said it's not always so simple as getting them in one class especially when the injury or leaving schools doesn't happen until after signing day. It all contributed to Notre Dame's fall at the end of the year I was simply giving you the details as to how and why it happened and why they only had freshman back ups despite not having the scholarship limitations of USC.

 

[poewelch84]

Also Zaire will start tomorrow which is welcome news to me.

 

[purguy12]

Also Zaire will start tomorrow which is welcome news to me.

I agree. I also am hearing good recruiting news. Big weekend for ND they say. Look for 3 guys to pick ND on TV.

 

[poewelch84]

I agree. I also am hearing good recruiting news. Big weekend for ND they say. Look for 3 guys to pick ND on TV.

I'm guessing Alize Jones, St Brown, and either Jones II or Jamabo most likely Jones II.

 

[poewelch84]

Well that was a better first half than I expected. If that fake field goal had been called a TD it would have stood as a TD but because they couldn't see his knee at the time the ball crossed the plane it couldn't be over turned luckily for Notre Dame.

 

[purguy12]

Irish win Yessssss great game. Zaire is going to be a good one.

 

[poewelch84]

I agree Purguy Zaire is going to be good I think, he seems to have "it".

 

[socaljim242]

Good way to end the season for you guys.

 

[poewelch84]

Yes it was.

 

[Irish7478]

Wow, I didn't realize how many poster thought we would lose this game.

 

[poewelch84]

Yeah I didn't think they would win against LSU.