Good Things....

[Dr Cyanide 28]

Franklin is no better than Stephenson at RT. Clones. I'll hope for Watson improved play RT.

i dont see that many simularities in stephenson and franklin. One is a fluid athlete but soft as hell mentally and not consistent, the other is a hulk whose aggression outvalues his athleticism.

 

[Dr Cyanide 28]

Gotsis was never big enough or strong enough to complete in the NFL. Maybe drafting Walker at your position will push him . I think he's bigger and stronger this year. We shall hope because Denver drafted 2 developmental players in the top two rounds in 2016.

Everyone is raving about Gotsis so far. Says he looks like a different player. HUGE trunk and better burst. Said he lived in the weightroom this offseason and it shows. Looking forward to watching his tape

 

[cdumler7]

In this case you are probably more right than I want to admit to ...They never realy tryied to sign him ..

CD is also right with his statement as well .

Elway was right about ED as well not sure how he knew both would be basket cases injury wise .. Elway must be psychic

This is where you have to understand Elway though. There is a difference between liking a guy and knowing that he is way out of your price range and that of knowing the guy will never be a good player for you. With Franklin when he was with us he was a quality starting player. That is what got him his huge contract. Elway is not one that likes to pay top of the line money to a player unless they are an absolute star. So they could still like Franklin and not make him an offer knowing there is no way they can get close to the type of money he is wanting and got. So at that point then why even make him an offer that is just going to be an insult to him as a player?

 

[cdumler7]

Gotsis was never big enough or strong enough to complete in the NFL. Maybe drafting Walker at your position will push him . I think he's bigger and stronger this year. We shall hope because Denver drafted 2 developmental players in the top two rounds in 2016.

Not sure I agree with the "Big enough" argument. Coming into the NFL he already weighed 287 lbs. There are times that Wolfe has played well below that number and he has been good enough at a lower weight. Malik Jackson is another. Heck maybe the best defensive player in the NFL right now in Aaron Donald came into the league at 285 lbs.

 

[CEH]

Not sure I agree with the "Big enough" argument. Coming into the NFL he already weighed 287 lbs. There are times that Wolfe has played well below that number and he has been good enough at a lower weight. Malik Jackson is another. Heck maybe the best defensive player in the NFL right now in Aaron Donald came into the league at 285 lbs.

"Physically, I've told him all along: You've got to get bigger and stronger -- or else," Kollar said then. "These guys are too big and strong and tough in this league.

 

[cdumler7]

"Physically, I've told him all along: You've got to get bigger and stronger -- or else," Kollar said then. "These guys are too big and strong and tough in this league.

I'm not sure more weight is the exact answer here. To me what I read in that is "stronger and stronger." Turn that fat into muscle and make that 287 lbs. look good. IF he put on 10 lbs. I wouldn't complain one bit but I'm not sure he needs to in order to play his position well. Wolfe and Jackson like I said both played around that weight and did just fine in both the pass and run game.

 

[Dr Cyanide 28]

This is where you have to understand Elway though. There is a difference between liking a guy and knowing that he is way out of your price range and that of knowing the guy will never be a good player for you. With Franklin when he was with us he was a quality starting player. That is what got him his huge contract. Elway is not one that likes to pay top of the line money to a player unless they are an absolute star. So they could still like Franklin and not make him an offer knowing there is no way they can get close to the type of money he is wanting and got. So at that point then why even make him an offer that is just going to be an insult to him as a player?

same thing with decker. Woulda been great to bring him back, but we didn't have cap room and he isn't a star.

 

[cdumler7]

same thing with decker. Woulda been great to bring him back, but we didn't have cap room and he isn't a star.

And not worth wasting their time or the team's time to give them a lowball offer that the team knows the player would not agree to. I'm sure their agent has given the team a number of what the player thinks they are worth and if they are nowhere in the ballpark then just not worth it.

 

[58crash]

Gotsis was never big enough or strong enough to complete in the NFL. Maybe drafting Walker at your position will push him . I think he's bigger and stronger this year. We shall hope because Denver drafted 2 developmental players in the top two rounds in 2016.

You also need to factor in the knee injury

 

[58crash]

same thing with decker. Woulda been great to bring him back, but we didn't have cap room and he isn't a star.

The deal is we never offed him a dime ............................We did not want him ....he said he was rather upset because was not offered a contract of any kind after the Season was over .. Now I will say Elway did before his contract year did offer I believe a reasonable contract not sure of the numbers ED probably turned it down ...

What killed that SB for me and I said crap we are going to lose was Elway let it out that they were moving on from ED . that was IMO crazy . that took all the chemistry that team built and killed it .

 

[Mingo]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Here I am at the scene of the crime. That thread I had started was right here and now Eric Decker has broken in or been thrown in -demanding work - or a few more paychecks. This attracts the yaes and nays of various talent scouts who reside around here and here I am coming in to see what are new good things by a Denver Bronco player or group of players.

I like me some good old Eric Decker comments too, but it is like gang spraying this thread.

And Remember- Stay the heck off my lawn!

 

[randymon]

Not really. Cut players are not viewed as being worth it. Players not re-signed might be valued by the organization just not fit in financially to their plans moving forward. Such as Broncos valued Malik trying to get him re-signed but he priced himself out of Denver.

Oh, ok. Thanks for clearing that up Cd.

 

[randymon]

Obviously there are a few people on here including myself that are not in the loop with what Elway is thinking and the reasons the organization makes these decisions that they do, who's actually behind those decisions and exactly the circumstances that weighed in those decisions. Therefore, our misguided rationalization or assumptions of anything that goes on with Broncos, is pointless when there are some on here who communicate with John/staff on a regular and personal basis ( lunch,cell,barbecues,etc ) and can just tell us what Elway and himself talked about over beers and wings the other day and quit making us look stupid with no real facts to support it. It would save so much controversy and speculation if it just came from the horses mouth,so to speak.

 

[randymon]

Only to the simple minded.

Seriously. I miss you when your absent from time to time. Your the only one here that makes me reflect on myself and also on those less fortunate. Don't be a stranger my friend.

 

[randymon]

i dont see that many simularities in stephenson and franklin. One is a fluid athlete but soft as hell mentally and not consistent, the other is a hulk whose aggression outvalues his athleticism.

Clone might not have been right word. More like " similar lack of consistency and production " but look nothing like each other facially or body type. Hope that helps clear up my stupid clone reference.

 

[cdumler7]

Obviously there are a few people on here including myself that are not in the loop with what Elway is thinking and the reasons the organization makes these decisions that they do, who's actually behind those decisions and exactly the circumstances that weighed in those decisions. Therefore, our misguided rationalization or assumptions of anything that goes on with Broncos, is pointless when there are some on here who communicate with John/staff on a regular and personal basis ( lunch,cell,barbecues,etc ) and can just tell us what Elway and himself talked about over beers and wings the other day and quit making us look stupid with no real facts to support it. It would save so much controversy and speculation if it just came from the horses mouth,so to speak.

Football isn't some rocket science thing to figure out. You can only prioritize paying so many players. In 2015 when Orlando Franklin came up for a contract Broncos already had quite a few big contracts on the books and some big ones coming up. The year before we had just signed Ware, Ward, Talib, and Sanders. They also just got done signing Chris Harris to a good size deal in December. Factor in having Peyton Manning on the books, thinking about whether the team needed to re-sign Osweiler after the 2015 season was over, and just the value of the position that Franklin was playing at the time.

You factor in all those things and yes Franklin walking makes a lot of sense both short term and long term. That doesn't mean they didn't like what he brought on the field or that they wanted him to walk away from the team. This isn't the video game Madden where you can turn off the cap though. You only have so much to go around and the Broncos' FO has shown to be one of the best at making sure to keep their cap situation under control. They do that by making sure to mostly sign top tier players or at least get those players for below market value. In house signings so far for the Broncos have been Harris, Miller, DT, Clady, Wolfe, Green, Anderson, and I think that is it. So either they are a top-tier player at their respective position or they signed a below market value contract that the Broncos deemed worthy of bringing back.

 

[Orange Crush77]

I always thought Franklin was a solid RT. I know broncogreg liked him a lot and he was very astute when it came to analyzing O line

 

[randymon]

Football isn't some rocket science thing to figure out. You can only prioritize paying so many players. In 2015 when Orlando Franklin came up for a contract Broncos already had quite a few big contracts on the books and some big ones coming up. The year before we had just signed Ware, Ward, Talib, and Sanders. They also just got done signing Chris Harris to a good size deal in December. Factor in having Peyton Manning on the books, thinking about whether the team needed to re-sign Osweiler after the 2015 season was over, and just the value of the position that Franklin was playing at the time.

You factor in all those things and yes Franklin walking makes a lot of sense both short term and long term. That doesn't mean they didn't like what he brought on the field or that they wanted him to walk away from the team. This isn't the video game Madden where you can turn off the cap though. You only have so much to go around and the Broncos' FO has shown to be one of the best at making sure to keep their cap situation under control. They do that by making sure to mostly sign top tier players or at least get those players for below market value. In house signings so far for the Broncos have been Harris, Miller, DT, Clady, Wolfe, Green, Anderson, and I think that is it. So either they are a top-tier player at their respective position or they signed a below market value contract that the Broncos deemed worthy of bringing back.

Really good rebuttal Cd. Denver let's Franklin " walk " and he goes to SD, sucks it up so bad that after 2 yrs of a 5 yr hefty contract considering market for tackles at that time, and they dump his ass and eat 3.5 mil.SD fucked up. Elway saw the production vs cost with Franklin and unless he was willing to come back at his price, he could kiss off. Elway was smart. SD were idiots. Elway saw writing on wall.

 

[LGM]

Obviously there are a few people on here including myself that are not in the loop with what Elway is thinking and the reasons the organization makes these decisions that they do, who's actually behind those decisions and exactly the circumstances that weighed in those decisions. Therefore, our misguided rationalization or assumptions of anything that goes on with Broncos, is pointless when there are some on here who communicate with John/staff on a regular and personal basis ( lunch,cell,barbecues,etc ) and can just tell us what Elway and himself talked about over beers and wings the other day and quit making us look stupid with no real facts to support it. It would save so much controversy and speculation if it just came from the horses mouth,so to speak.

I laughed.

But you both have valid points; nobody gets to hear the conversations had by the front office and back channel discussions through players, coaches, or agents. Nobody gets to hear what someone said. I'm sure we'd all love to be a fly on the wall, but nobody here (or anywhere) gets to be in the room.

That said, I know for a fact there are a few among us who are about as close as the outsider can get with sources, friends, etc. And while what they hear may be third hand, its as close as it gets.

Nobody knows but the ones doing the talking what is true and what isn't... That's what makes the offseason so fun.

 

[cdumler7]

I always thought Franklin was a solid RT. I know broncogreg liked him a lot and he was very astute when it came to analyzing O line

I thought he did fine at both RT and RG for us. He just had a lot working against him for any kind of return to the Broncos.

1) Position he was playing at the time of LG just wasn't a huge value in Elway's mind.
2) Coaching switch and OL switch going from PBS to ZBS which is not a great fit for him.
3) The prices teams were willing to spend on him greatly outweighed anything the Broncos could offer. Even if he was willing to take a home town discount we are probably talking close to a 50% discount which no player does.
4) He wasn't exactly happy about his switch to guard as he liked tackle a lot more. Funny then he goes to the Chargers and continues to play guard. Figured he would look for a team that valued him as a tackle.
5) Broncos already just spent big the offseason before and were not exactly cap rich in 2015.
6) They also needed to look to the future knowing they for sure had to get Von Miller re-signed and then at that point the question was what is Osweiler to the team?

He was one of the few FA's we have let walk that I was actively not happy to see go. He brought a level of intensity to the OL that nobody else on the team came close to. Injuries though seem to have really zapped his abilities down quite a bit from his time with the Chargers. And really that whole situation was not set up for success. He had terrible talent around him (compare that to having Vasquez when he was an All-Pro in 2013) and not only did he struggle through injuries but that entire OL for the Chargers was devastated.