Comedy Platinum out of Toronto - "Canada's Team" quest for the Cup

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Personally, I favo(u)r this approach. The list of recent Cup winners contains names like Oduya, Hjalmarsson, Timmonen, Maata, Daley, etc as Dmen who substantially contributed. Totally agree, you can build a Cup-worthy defense corps with names like Rielly, Gardiner (and even Hunwick, and Polak). We will need one stud though, and that's where I am concerned for the Leafs. That is probably the toughest nut to crack for Lou.

Even the bigger guys - Keith, Letang, Vlasic, Weber, Subban...none of those guys were first rounders. They just need their scouting and development advantage to merge with some luck at some point.

Also, while Polak might've bought himself a new contract with his play as of late I'm guessing Hunwick at least is gone. If they wind up needing to expose (and potentially lose) Carrick in the expansion draft there'll be at least two defence slots to open up. There’s also an argument to be made that Zaitsev might be worth selling high on rather than keeping around.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Let's also keep in mind that the Leafs have actually had some luck with defencemen this decade, they just haven't always been the main beneficiary of that luck. Anton Stralman is a fine top pairing player who the Leafs drafted in the 7th round. Jake Gardiner was a throw-in on a bi-dumpular deal with Anaheim and is currently our best defenceman. Franson was pretty productive here despite playing Randy Carlyle hockey.

I'm confident they'll figure it out. If we're still having this conversation in two years it'll be a problem.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

Even the bigger guys - Keith, Letang, Vlasic, Weber, Subban...none of those guys were first rounders. They just need their scouting and development advantage to merge with some luck at some point.

Also, while Polak might've bought himself a new contract with his play as of late I'm guessing Hunwick at least is gone. If they wind up needing to expose (and potentially lose) Carrick in the expansion draft there'll be at least two defence slots to open up. There’s also an argument to be made that Zaitsev might be worth selling high on rather than keeping around.

The problem with the Leafs is the same as it was with the Oilers around 2014-15. Well, one of the Oilers' many problems. And it's not as severe as it was with the Oilers. But still the same dilemma!! Since D take longer to develop it's hard to draft and develop one AFTER you've already got your top notch young forwards. It usually takes 4-6 years for a D to go from draft to upper echelon. If we say five years from this draft that puts Matthews and Marner one year from UFA and departure/cap issues.

Because the Leafs actually have some decent youngish D-men (Gardiner, Rielly, Zaitsev) their problem is nowhere near as pronounced as the Coil's was. Still a tough problem to solve. The Leafs might have to use a Marner or a Nylander to pick up a true #1 D though.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

The problem with the Leafs is the same as it was with the Oilers around 2014-15. Well, one of the Oilers' many problems. And it's not as severe as it was with the Oilers. But still the same dilemma!! Since D take longer to develop it's hard to draft and develop one AFTER you've already got your top notch young forwards. It usually takes 4-6 years for a D to go from draft to upper echelon. If we say five years from this draft that puts Matthews and Marner one year from UFA and departure/cap issues.

Because the Leafs actually have some decent youngish D-men (Gardiner, Rielly, Zaitsev) their problem is nowhere near as pronounced as the Coil's was. Still a tough problem to solve. The Leafs might have to use a Marner or a Nylander to pick up a true #1 D though.

I said that the Leafs would eventually have to trade one of Nylander or Marner in order to bring in a top D at some point a while back and a few months later I'm not really sure if I'd do that. I think it might make more sense to exhaust all options while keeping them before going down that road.

This is definitely where Lou is going to earn his salary though, along with finding Matthews some permanent wingers once Nylander moves to centre and some 4th line depth.

 

[DragonfromTO]

Let's also keep in mind that the Leafs have actually had some luck with defencemen this decade, they just haven't always been the main beneficiary of that luck. Anton Stralman is a fine top pairing player who the Leafs drafted in the 7th round. Jake Gardiner was a throw-in on a bi-dumpular deal with Anaheim and is currently our best defenceman. Franson was pretty productive here despite playing Randy Carlyle hockey.

I'm confident they'll figure it out. If we're still having this conversation in two years it'll be a problem.

Gardiner wasn't really a throw-in though, he was the whole reason the Leafs made the deal. Beauchemin wasn't unwanted throwaway like Lupul was at the time, he was an actual asset.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Gardiner wasn't really a throw-in though, he was the whole reason the Leafs made the deal. Beauchemin wasn't unwanted throwaway like Lupul was at the time, he was an actual asset.

I don't recall Beauchemin's stock being very high by the time he was moved.

 

[DragonfromTO]

I don't recall Beauchemin's stock being very high by the time he was moved.

Well obviously his value wasn't enough to get Gardiner, but that's why we had to take Lupul back.

Here's the PPP discussion of the trade, along with another write-up where Beauchemin's value was discussed. I know it's kind of tough to look at and put yourself in a past frame of mind but the commentary doesn't suggest that Beauchemin was thought of as without value.

Leafs Trade Beauchemin for Lupul, Gardiner, Pick

Francois Beauchemin on the Trade Block?

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Well obviously his value wasn't enough to get Gardiner, but that's why we had to take Lupul back.

Here's the PPP discussion of the trade, along with another write-up where Beauchemin's value was discussed. I know it's kind of tough to look at and put yourself in a past frame of mind but the commentary doesn't suggest that Beauchemin was thought of as without value.

Leafs Trade Beauchemin for Lupul, Gardiner, Pick

Francois Beauchemin on the Trade Block?

I dunno. He was their top minute eater and his production had essentially flatlined while the team tailspinned. Jake was a late first round pick in a weak draft and was described as "the second ranked prospect" on a team that wasn't exactly stacking their farm at the time.

Even if he was the focal point on the return for the Leafs, he's excelled beyond what anybody imagined at the time.

 

[DragonfromTO]

I dunno. He was their top minute eater and his production had essentially flatlined while the team tailspinned. Jake was a late first round pick in a weak draft and was described as "the second ranked prospect" on a team that wasn't exactly stacking their farm at the time.

Even if he was the focal point on the return for the Leafs, he's excelled beyond what anybody imagined at the time.

Pronman still had the Ducks ranked 10th the summer after they traded Gardiner, it's not like it was a barren system. And like I said, I know it's difficult to put your head back where it was at a previous moment in time but I think you're underrating how Gardiner was regarded. What he's become obviously wasn't a certainty but I don't think that it was unimaginable at all. This is him fulfilling his potential.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Things I'm particularly happy about today: Tyler Bozak is finally 50 point player. Not bad at all for a college signing.

 

[BGDave]

Since D take longer to develop it's hard to draft and develop one AFTER you've already got your top notch young forwards. It usually takes 4-6 years for a D to go from draft to upper echelon. If we say five years from this draft that puts Matthews and Marner one year from UFA and departure/cap issues.

Agreed, and stated much better than I could have put it.

 

[BGDave]

Things I'm particularly happy about today: Tyler Bozak is finally 50 point player. Not bad at all for a college signing.

And really better than most of them.

NCAA signings tend to be vastly overhyped.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

And really better than most of them.

NCAA signings tend to be vastly overhyped.

In the past ten years I can't really say any others have been better pro's than Bozak. Krug maybe.

 

[BGDave]

What's the local word on Freddie?

Serious injury, or did his psychic tell him what was coming and he bailed?

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

What's the local word on Freddie?

Serious injury, or did his psychic tell him what was coming and he bailed?

Likely concussion-related. We'll hopefully hear more after practice this morning.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I obviously hope Andersen's alright but if he's totally fine, felt no symptoms and was pulled solely at the discretion of the Buffalo team doctor based on something he thinks he saw on the ice somebody somewhere is going to have some explaining to do.

 

[BGDave]

the Buffalo team doctor

The home team doctor makes the concussion protocol decisions?

Oy vey.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

The home team doctor makes the concussion protocol decisions?

Oy vey.

I think the issue is the Leafs didn't bring their doctor on the road. Don't know if that's SOP or not but if it cost Andersen 2 periods in a tight game, well, that should probably change regardless.

FWIW, he's been on the ice for an hour before practice. Guess that's a good sign.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Shit.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Official shit.