Active hall of famers

[calsnowskier]

Cutch isn't in yet, but he is certainly on the HOF track.

 

[navamind]

How about Scherzer? He's definitely been a top 5 pitcher over the last four years and has 37+ WAR (by both Fangraphs and BBRef). He does have a CYA under his belt, two no-hitters and a 20 K game. Those single game accomplishments only mean so much, but there will be voters that will wet themselves over such feats.

Max Scherzer Statistics and History | Baseball-Reference.com

He had some pretty bad defenses behind him in Detroit as well. He's got a lot of work to do in terms of career stats, don't get me wrong, but I don't think it's entirely unreasonable to think he could have at least a borderline case by the time he retires.

 

[broncosmitty]

I watched too much early Max to think of him as a HOFer, right now.

But since he figured out how to go deeper into games. (Don't nibble, or straight waste so many pitches.) he's elevated to a level higher than I thought he was capable.

Could use even a pretend move to first still.

 

[navamind]

I watched too much early Max to think of him as a HOFer, right now.

But since he figured out how to go deeper into games. (Don't nibble, or straight waste so many pitches.) he's elevated to a level higher than I thought he was capable.

Could use even a pretend move to first still.

That's fair. He was a pretty middling pitcher pitcher prior to 2013 (though he had a few good years).

 

[broncosmitty]

That's fair. He was a pretty middling pitcher pitcher prior to 2013 (though he had a few good years).

His talent was obvious. But seven innings was about Max' Max. It was frustrating as hell sometimes. But to his credit, he was gonna give you six. Super locked it,(no homers ahead in the count) seven.

His career is kinda two halves, to me, so far. He needs to stretch this half a couple seasons more before the back end of his career starts.

 

[navamind]

The 20 K game felt kinda inevitable after this performance.

 

[broncosmitty]

The 20 K game felt kinda inevitable after this performance.

I think that was right after he got brought back up.

Remember listening to that Kfest while I was camping over Memorial Day.

 

[navamind]

what does everyone think of Votto? I think he could use another All-Star season, but I think he's got a pretty good case right now. He's around 50.4 WAR (Fangraphs; 51.3 per BB-Ref), but that's with only 5800 PA. He does have 34 WAA, which compares pretty well to most Hall of Famers. He has a career line of .313/.425/.541 (best OBP among active players, 12th all-time) and a 158 OPS+ (18th all-time). He has six top ten seasons in WAR as well and an MVP to his credit.

2017 might end up being the best season of his career. He's batting .316/.426/.625 (166 wRC+), and that's with his .295 BABIP being way below his career norm (.354). He could end up with a much better line that that.

 

[soxfan1468927]

what does everyone think of Votto? I think he could use another All-Star season, but I think he's got a pretty good case right now. He's around 50.4 WAR (Fangraphs; 51.3 per BB-Ref), but that's with only 5800 PA. He does have 34 WAA, which compares pretty well to most Hall of Famers. He has a career line of .313/.425/.541 (best OBP among active players, 12th all-time) and a 158 OPS+ (18th all-time). He has six top ten seasons in WAR as well and an MVP to his credit.

2017 might end up being the best season of his career. He's batting .316/.426/.625 (166 wRC+), and that's with his .295 BABIP being way below his career norm (.354). He could end up with a much better line that that.

Votto is a good one. I think a few more years and he would be in for me. Has led the league in OBP 5 times. Since 1901, only Williams, Bonds, Ruth, Hornsby, Cobb, Boggs, Musial, Gehrig, and Yaz have done that. Damn good company for a valuable statistic. I wonder how much the RBI are going to hurt him. Right now he has fewer RBI (and about the same games played) as Richie Sexson. I have hope that we've grown out of weighing that too heavily, and maybe more in 10+ years when he is up for a vote, but I still think that will be counted against him.

 

[navamind]

I watched too much early Max to think of him as a HOFer, right now.

But since he figured out how to go deeper into games. (Don't nibble, or straight waste so many pitches.) he's elevated to a level higher than I thought he was capable.

Could use even a pretend move to first still.

Scherzer with a pretty ridiculous 1st half. ERA will probably regress but even then, he's well on his way to another elite season and possibly another CYA. His strikeout rate (12.2 K/9) is currently the 9th best among individual seasons, though it's only the 2nd best in 2017 (Sale's 12.5 ranks 5th). His 0.77 WHIP is currently the 3rd best of all-time.

 

[navamind]

Votto is a good one. I think a few more years and he would be in for me. Has led the league in OBP 5 times. Since 1901, only Williams, Bonds, Ruth, Hornsby, Cobb, Boggs, Musial, Gehrig, and Yaz have done that. Damn good company for a valuable statistic. I wonder how much the RBI are going to hurt him. Right now he has fewer RBI (and about the same games played) as Richie Sexson. I have hope that we've grown out of weighing that too heavily, and maybe more in 10+ years when he is up for a vote, but I still think that will be counted against him.

I also wonder if Votto's relative unpopularity among Reds fans will also hurt him.

Funny part is after years of bashing Votto, Marty Brenneman recently said he was "the best pure hitter in franchise history"

 

[broncosmitty]

Scherzer with a pretty ridiculous 1st half. ERA will probably regress but even then, he's well on his way to another elite season and possibly another CYA. His strikeout rate (12.2 K/9) is currently the 9th best among individual seasons, though it's only the 2nd best in 2017 (Sale's 12.5 ranks 5th). His 0.77 WHIP is currently the 3rd best of all-time.

He and Sale (not last night) are having historical seasons. More than impressive what they're doing with the ball flying all over hell against mortal pitching.

Robbie Ray at 12 surprised me. He's absolutely dominant on the road, but I didn't realize his rate was that high. DD loves trading for those power arms. Too bad he traded the younger one for Shane fucking Greene.

 

[Win TWINS!!!]

I'm not sure it means anything in terms of Mauer's HOF chances, but I've always been impressed with the fact that only six catchers in the history of baseball have ever won batting titles, and Joe Mauer is three of them.

PEDs

 

[navamind]

He and Sale (not last night) are having historical seasons. More than impressive what they're doing with the ball flying all over hell against mortal pitching.

Robbie Ray at 12 surprised me. He's absolutely dominant on the road, but I didn't realize his rate was that high. DD loves trading for those power arms. Too bad he traded the younger one for Shane fucking Greene.

Ray does need to cut down on the walks, 4.42 per 9 is a lot.

Most of DD's trades have worked out for Detroit, but yeah that one doesn't look good especially given how crappy the Tigers pitching is now.

 

[navamind]

Cutch isn't in yet, but he is certainly on the HOF track.

2016 hurt his case a bit, but he's rebounded with a strong 2017 thus far.

 

[broncosmitty]

2016 hurt his case a bit, but he's rebounded with a strong 2017 thus far.

He's on fire right now.

There was a time when I assumed his option wouldn't be picked up. Not now.

 

[broncosmitty]

PEDs

He needs to do them again.

 

[Win TWINS!!!]

He needs to do them again.

Nah. I was joking about the PEDs. He's never been one to get loft under the ball. What has bit him, was the defensive shift. Too predictable. Not sure of anyone that has suffered more from it.

 

[navamind]

Donaldson's got a lot of work to do and he's going to be 32 years old by the beginning of the 2018 season, but there's a good case to be made for him being the 2nd best player in MLB over the last 5 years. This year's injury doesn't help as he's having another amazing year (.268/.391/.558, 30 home runs despite playing only 102 games). We'll see in a few years, but he could put together a decent case.

.282/.377/.523, 147 wRC+, 144 OPS+, 35.1 WAR (2nd behind only Trout, albeit by a good margin; but Donaldson also ranks way ahead of everyone else). He also rated as one of the best defensive 3B from 2013-15, though his defense is declining (at least going by DRS and UZR)

He ranks 33rd among 3rd basemen in JAWS despite the short career.

 

[JohnU]

We were discussing this on the Giants board, thought I'd take it to the general:

Which players that will be active in 2016 (so no Jeter....) will make the Hall of Fame in your opinion? Including young ones that you think will make it (if their careers last the normal amount of time).

In my opinion, the only locks if their careers ended tomorrow are Pujols and probably Cabrera, maybe Beltre or Molina. Long shot Ortiz, maybe even Verlander. Some of these will get in with 1-2 more productive years.

There's a group of players that pass the eye test of HOFers but if their career ended tomorrow it would mean they fall short because not enough playing time to justify it: Posey, Trout, Harper, Kershaw, Goldschmidt

Then there's A-Rod. If Bonds and Clemens eventually make it I have to think he does too.

Any I've overlooked?

Joey Votto's numbers are off the charts.