Well....looks like the Sun Belt is dropping Idaho and NMSU in 2017

Cave_Johnson · Mar 1, 2016

I've said before that I thought it was in the best interest of the conference to extend both schools for an extra few years before letting them go. Odd, and kind of a dick move, that they announce this a full week before the presidents were scheduled to vote. My guess is most of the eastern schools minds were already made up before the presentations last week and they didn't think it was necessary to carry through with the scheduled vote. I know at least Arkansas State wanted NMSU as a full member and wanted Idaho extended.

Options beyond 2017 are now limited to Independent or FCS unless something crazy happens.

Independent doesn't work long term, but there are several FBS games already scheduled until the early 2020's. No reason not to at least try to stay alive in FBS for a few years and see if something pans out. FCS is a death sentence. Dropping to that dying division is a great way to lose revenue, tank attendance even further, and make sure you drop some women's sports along the way to due Title IX and scholarship cuts. Not to mention all the effects not related to athletics.

BoiseStateFan27 · Mar 1, 2016

Someone brought up a crazy scenario today that possibly the Big Sky could move up to FBS

If they added North Dakota State and South Dakota State they wouldn't be too much worse than the Sun Belt

and since we keep adding bowls half the league will get in one in the first year.

FaCe-LeE-uS · Mar 1, 2016

I don't think that I have even heard of the FCS?

This sucks... Dropping out of the FBS would demolish their finances. Much of the Vandals Athletic budget is financed by OOC games. Drop to FCS and almost all of that will dissapear.

But a move back to the Big Sky sounds smart considering the stadium is only full at Homecoming and basically empty in all the other games. The regional matchups will bring in more fans and the FCS status will bring more competitive games.

Cave_Johnson · Mar 2, 2016

BoiseStateFan27 said:
Someone brought up a crazy scenario today that possibly the Big Sky could move up to FBS

If they added North Dakota State and South Dakota State they wouldn't be too much worse than the Sun Belt

and since we keep adding bowls half the league will get in one in the first year.

I've heard some people throw that around, but I'm not sure how likely it is. There is some talk about splitting the conference for other reasons however. This article has some info on that.

Big Sky could be in Idaho football's future after leaving Sun Belt

Cave_Johnson · Mar 2, 2016

FaCe-LeE-uS said:
I don't think that I have even heard of the FCS?

This sucks... Dropping out of the FBS would demolish their finances. Much of the Vandals Athletic budget is financed by OOC games. Drop to FCS and almost all of that will dissapear.

But a move back to the Big Sky sounds smart considering the stadium is only full at Homecoming and basically empty in all the other games. The regional matchups will bring in more fans and the FCS status will bring more competitive games.

Yup. Financially FCS is a terrible option. I'm not sure the regional matchups bring in any better attendance. Sure Montana, MSU, and EWU probably draw decent crowds. But Southern Utah, Northern Colorado, and UC Davis? Count on the stadium being just as empty if not worse.

Just like with any FBS team winning will lead to better attendance ( see the 2009 season ). But even back in the late 80's/early 90's when the team was winning at the D1aa level attendance was nothing spectacular.

Cave_Johnson · Mar 2, 2016

NMSU is reportedly going to attempt to be independent for at least two years after the Sun Belt agreement is up. Good move on their part. Might as well try to stay afloat in FBS. Idaho would be wise to follow suit.

Cave_Johnson · Mar 2, 2016

Cave_Johnson said:
NMSU is reportedly going to attempt to be independent for at least two years after the Sun Belt agreement is up. Good move on their part. Might as well try to stay afloat in FBS. Idaho would be wise to follow suit.

Well from what I'm hearing there's a strong possibility the decision has already been made and it will be the Big Sky.

Typing that made me want to throw up. Pretty much zero upside to this decision. Words can not describe how idiotic this would be without at least attempting to stay afloat in FBS as an independent for a few years.

Cave_Johnson · Mar 3, 2016

Word is Rob Spear is working on an independent schedule for 2018, but that doesn't mean it won't get shot down.

DHoey · Mar 3, 2016

I wish Idaho well, but I don't see how dropping back to D-2 is a death sentence. There is really good football in the Big Sky, and the northern schools do fairly well in terms of attendance.

Cave_Johnson · Mar 3, 2016

DHoey said:
I wish Idaho well, but I don't see how dropping back to D-2 is a death sentence. There is really good football in the Big Sky, and the northern schools do fairly well in terms of attendance.

Look, I have nothing against the teams playing Big Sky football right now. If Idaho had never moved up I would probably be fine with their situation. But they did move up. And when they've had a stable conference and consistent coaching ( that's only occurred in maybe 5 years since 1996) they've been competitive. They can compete at this level. I'm as big of a sports pessimist as there is but even I can see that Paul Petrino has this team on the rise. Dropping down without even trying the independent route is basically throwing in the towel. You drop down and you take scholarships away from student athletes ( men's and women's), you lose revenue, and you lose exposure. There's a reason many teams are moving out of FCS. It's a dying division, they see the writing on the wall, and they know where the money is. It's unfortunate, but football has an effect on everything. Enrollment, academics, etc. This move will only hurt the university as a whole.

The key thing most don't seem to realize is that dropping down means players can transfer without penalty. And the coaches? They're gone too. Also, transitional teams can't make the playoffs for the first two years. So basically you end up cleaning house. I can just imagine the recruiting pitch for this program.

"We lost most of our players and have a completely new coaching staff. We just dropped down a division because we gave up on FBS. Oh yeah, and you won't be able to compete for anything meaningful for a few years. But this team was good in this league 20 years ago so it's really nothing to worry about."

That won't go over well. You'd end up with 4+ years of bad FCS ball before you MIGHT see some improvement.

And yeah Idaho's attendance isn't great, but the Big Sky average is still right around the attendance Idaho has on Thanksgiving break when all the students are gone. And that average includes Montana and Montana State who average 10,000+ more fans than pretty much every other team. By the way Montana and Montana State don't have to compete with WSU ( 8 miles away ) and Boise ( where most of Idaho's alumni live). I just don't see how dropping down does anything but lose fans.

Sorry for the long-winded response. Not trying to come across as an asshole, I just feel really strongly about this particular issue.

FaCe-LeE-uS · Mar 7, 2016

Cave_Johnson said:
Look, I have nothing against the teams playing Big Sky football right now. If Idaho had never moved up I would probably be fine with their situation. But they did move up. And when they've had a stable conference and consistent coaching ( that's only occurred in maybe 5 years since 1996) they've been competitive. They can compete at this level. I'm as big of a sports pessimist as there is but even I can see that Paul Petrino has this team on the rise. Dropping down without even trying the independent route is basically throwing in the towel. You drop down and you take scholarships away from student athletes ( men's and women's), you lose revenue, and you lose exposure. There's a reason many teams are moving out of FCS. It's a dying division, they see the writing on the wall, and they know where the money is. It's unfortunate, but football has an effect on everything. Enrollment, academics, etc. This move will only hurt the university as a whole.

The key thing most don't seem to realize is that dropping down means players can transfer without penalty. And the coaches? They're gone too. Also, transitional teams can't make the playoffs for the first two years. So basically you end up cleaning house. I can just imagine the recruiting pitch for this program.

"We lost most of our players and have a completely new coaching staff. We just dropped down a division because we gave up on FBS. Oh yeah, and you won't be able to compete for anything meaningful for a few years. But this team was good in this league 20 years ago so it's really nothing to worry about."

That won't go over well. You'd end up with 4+ years of bad FCS ball before you MIGHT see some improvement.

And yeah Idaho's attendance isn't great, but the Big Sky average is still right around the attendance Idaho has on Thanksgiving break when all the students are gone. And that average includes Montana and Montana State who average 10,000+ more fans than pretty much every other team. By the way Montana and Montana State don't have to compete with WSU ( 8 miles away ) and Boise ( where most of Idaho's alumni live). I just don't see how dropping down does anything but lose fans.

Sorry for the long-winded response. Not trying to come across as an asshole, I just feel really strongly about this particular issue.

FaCe-LeE-uS · Apr 3, 2016

Any Spring scrimmage updates? How's Luton looking?

Haven't heard much. But I admit I haven't been paying very close attention this offseason.

Cave_Johnson · Apr 4, 2016

FaCe-LeE-uS said:
Any Spring scrimmage updates? How's Luton looking?

Haven't heard much. But I admit I haven't been paying very close attention this offseason.

Had a scrimmage this weekend in Lewiston. Here's the story from the Spokane CBS affiliate:

Vandals offense impresses in scrimmage

Sounds like Luton is making some good progress, he's getting most of the reps with Linehan sitting out the spring with a lingering foot injury so he'll have plenty of opportunity to improve. I liked what I saw from him in his limited time last year. He's definitely more physically gifted than Linehan, just needs to improve his accuracy a bit.

Offense doesn't lose much other than Penny, but those are big shoes to fill right now. Probably going to be RB by committee this year with Duckworth leading the charge.

Defense at least gets a few secondary guys back who missed most of last year with injuries. D-line depth seems like it shouldn't be an issue even with some key losses. LB will be interesting. Lost 3 of 4 starters but Kaden Ellis returns after a great freshman season and Hazewood will be back after missing a lot of time last year. Fingers crossed the D can stay healthy, last season was a mess on that side of the ball.

Cave_Johnson · Apr 18, 2016

Puget Sound and Ada County VSF Chapters have now both come out strongly against a move to FCS.

Ada County, Puget Sound Make Statements

Cave_Johnson · Apr 27, 2016

Drop to FCS expected to be announced tomorrow.

R.I.P. Vandal football. Had a long run, but administrative failures, lack of leadership, and awful hires in the athletic department did you in. Better to put yourself out of your misery than fade into even more obscurity.

Now if you excuse me I'm going to take my own advice and take a bath with my toaster.

Cave_Johnson · May 18, 2016

ULM committed to future in FBS football

How many schools is that now that have made statements about the importance of staying FBS? Answer: Every single school where the drop down to FCS has been suggested.

UMass voted the move down.

The AD at Eastern Michigan ( at least, I think it was the AD) denounced the FCS move stating that financially it would be irresponsible.

NMSU found they would lose money dropping to FCS. They have already committed to staying the course in FBS as long as possible.

Granted, ULM's situation is different than Idaho's. But at UMass and NMSU the situations are very similar. They just don't have chicken-shit, dickless Presidents who hire consulting firms to throw together unprofessional, unscientific studies in order to justify this pussy move. By the way, that study didn't actually provide any results that suggested the Big Sky was the right move. I just ignored the independent route as a possibility and showed that moving to the Big Sky would allowed Idaho to spend less on travel and pay the coaches less ( yes, that last part is actually in there).

Eat my ass Chuck Staben. You and your Far Side-character-looking wife.

UTVolCountry · Jun 6, 2016

Cave_Johnson said:
ULM committed to future in FBS football

How many schools is that now that have made statements about the importance of staying FBS? Answer: Every single school where the drop down to FCS has been suggested.

UMass voted the move down.

The AD at Eastern Michigan ( at least, I think it was the AD) denounced the FCS move stating that financially it would be irresponsible.

NMSU found they would lose money dropping to FCS. They have already committed to staying the course in FBS as long as possible.

Granted, ULM's situation is different than Idaho's. But at UMass and NMSU the situations are very similar. They just don't have chicken-shit, dickless Presidents who hire consulting firms to throw together unprofessional, unscientific studies in order to justify this pussy move. By the way, that study didn't actually provide any results that suggested the Big Sky was the right move. I just ignored the independent route as a possibility and showed that moving to the Big Sky would allowed Idaho to spend less on travel and pay the coaches less ( yes, that last part is actually in there).

Eat my ass Chuck Staben. You and your Far Side-character-looking wife.

Damn...sorry to hear that. Wishing you guys the best moving forward. I agree that they should try playing at FBS level as long as possibe.

Idaho loses wild football game at MTSU Still one of the best games I've eve been to...70-58 was the final score.

Cave_Johnson · Jun 9, 2016

UTVolCountry said:
Damn...sorry to hear that. Wishing you guys the best moving forward. I agree that they should try playing at FBS level as long as possibe.

Idaho loses wild football game at MTSU Still one of the best games I've eve been to...70-58 was the final score.

They should, but the president thinks he's the smartest guy in the room. There's a reason no other schools are doing what Idaho is doing. Nothing I can do about it now though except bitch on the internet. That, and continue to mail condoms that have been filled with my frozen shit to Chuck Staben's home. That's in Boise by the way, 300 miles south of Moscow.

Also, I'd wager both defenses in that game were better than the one Idaho fielded last year.

Cave_Johnson · Jun 9, 2016

FaCe-LeE-uS said:
Any Spring scrimmage updates? How's Luton looking?

Haven't heard much. But I admit I haven't been paying very close attention this offseason.

Just an update on Luton, but from what I'm hearing he is strongly considering transferring. As it stands now he'd be backing up Linehan for two more years leaving him with one year as the likely starter. That year would be the first back in FCS where I doubt there will be much to play for. This is just assuming he doesn't beat out Matt before the season starts.

Personally I don't blame the guy. He has all the physical tools to be a great player and has looked sharp when he's gotten some opportunities. No clue where he would be looking to go but I don't see him pulling a Chad Chalich and going to a Big Sky school.

Cave_Johnson · Jun 9, 2016

Cave_Johnson said:
Just an update on Luton, but from what I'm hearing he is strongly considering transferring. As it stands now he'd be backing up Linehan for two more years leaving him with one year as the likely starter. That year would be the first back in FCS where I doubt there will be much to play for. This is just assuming he doesn't beat out Matt before the season starts.

Personally I don't blame the guy. He has all the physical tools to be a great player and has looked sharp when he's gotten some opportunities. No clue where he would be looking to go but I don't see him pulling a Chad Chalich and going to a Big Sky school.

LOL it's official now.

He'll be the first of many I'm sure.

Well....looks like the Sun Belt is dropping Idaho and NMSU in 2017

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