politics thread

Sharkinva · May 21, 2018

gkekoa said:
I didn’t even read it because it I said a total joke. What is the source of black poverty in Africa?

As for leaving black people alone, that isn’t how black people vote. I agree with the statement that white people cant fix the black community. It is funny how white people are always drug into the discussion though.

Maybe its because white people control the banks, housing industry and government. And as such, have systematically made sure to maintain control??

Sharkinva · May 21, 2018

see here is the thing @gkekoa I actually DONT think you are a racist. I do think you have bought into the comfortable lie that America is an even playing field for all. When presented with facts, you fall back on the old tried and true, well it must be because of culture, or because they werent willing to work hard enough. You do seem to believe that laws and programs designed to try and level the playing field some how discriminate against you and yours.

But again at the end of the day I dont think you are racist (or you hide it very well). But I think you are complicit in a long standing system of racism because you are comfortable with the way things are.

gkekoa · May 21, 2018

Sharkinva said:
YOU did. You have made and stuck to the claim that it is ok to assume that a random black person is likely a part of the assumed negative culture. So you are basically saying, its ok to assume all of us are a part of this culture until proven otherwise and if given no other factors other than skin color.

So fun fact, less than 5% of the black male population of the COUNTRY is incarcerated at any given time. So you have basically judged an entire race on the actions of 5% of said population.

BUt again, I dont assume every white person I meet is a KKK member until proven otherwise, but you have stated that its OK to assume all blacks are a part of the gangster rap negative culture until they prove that they arent.

I didn’t say it was OK...I said it was a logical assumption that would be correct more often than not.

Actually, the 13% is a better statistic because it shows a history and a present when it comes to behavior of individuals.

And I don’t assume every black person is from a negative culture. Again, I have stated it is a logical assumption more than the opposite...if one is to assume.

gkekoa · May 21, 2018

Sharkinva said:
Maybe its because white people control the banks, housing industry and government. And as such, have systematically made sure to maintain control??

Or maybe that is what you want to believe because you can’t prove it.

gkekoa · May 21, 2018

Sharkinva said:
see here is the thing @gkekoa I actually DONT think you are a racist. I do think you have bought into the comfortable lie that America is an even playing field for all. When presented with facts, you fall back on the old tried and true, well it must be because of culture, or because they werent willing to work hard enough. You do seem to believe that laws and programs designed to try and level the playing field some how discriminate against you and yours.

But again at the end of the day I dont think you are racist (or you hide it very well). But I think you are complicit in a long standing system of racism because you are comfortable with the way things are.

You see, I don’t think it is an even playing field. I just think there are far greater factors than pigmentation holding people back.

The most telling statistical markers come from fatherlessness, education, and socioeconomic status...both of which are cultural. This holds true for whites too.

If I were to be more specific for you, if you don’t succeed, it started early. You didn’t try hard enough early or your parents didn’t demand you do well in school before you were old enough to know the repercussions of your actions. This put you behind from the beginning.

I don’t believe they discriminate, I have shown they discriminate. I understand the design but the model is flawed.

I am comfortable with how things are. I have offered suggestions that are truly color blind. I will not sit here and agree with you over conjecture and think the fix is to make the outcomes equal when one person does better than another.

Sharkinva · May 21, 2018

gkekoa said:
Or maybe that is what you want to believe because you can’t prove it.

OK IM going to channel Sam Jackson here...

Motherfucka please.

Who owns the Banks in this country??
Who for the most part owns the housing industry and thus sets housing prices??
Who for the most part runs the government and MAKES the laws??

And how many times have you been presented with evidence, legal evidence of racial and systematic bias against people of color and simply brushed it off??

So like I said, you might not be a cross burning, I hate people of color racist. But you are damn sure comfortable with the system NOT changing anymore than it already has.

Sharkinva · May 21, 2018

gkekoa said:
You see, I don’t think it is an even playing field. I just think there are far greater factors than pigmentation holding people back.

The most telling statistical markers come from fatherlessness, education, and socioeconomic status...both of which are cultural. This holds true for whites too.

If I were to be more specific for you, if you don’t succeed, it started early. You didn’t try hard enough early or your parents didn’t demand you do well in school before you were old enough to know the repercussions of your actions. This put you behind from the beginning.

I don’t believe they discriminate, I have shown they discriminate. I understand the design but the model is flawed.

I am comfortable with how things are. I have offered suggestions that are truly color blind. I will not sit here and agree with you over conjecture and think the fix is to make the outcomes equal when one person does better than another.

SO if you want a true color blind level playing field, that would require getting rid of

the census, any question designed to determine race on any type of application.

It would also require getting rid of for profit higher education, because lets be honest, a poor kid with a 4.0 GPA still might not be able to afford to go to college.

Require realistic housing standards and a realistic living wage. Because again, if that kid that got a 4.0 has to forgo college to take care of his family, then it is just feeding into the cycle that is broken.

I agree you cant solve discrimination by making another group feel discriminated against. But until such time as you can be assured that individuals wont discriminate, we do need laws in place to prevent them from doing just that. After all, not every one drives drunk, but we have laws in place to try prevent those who would make bad choices from driving drunk. And we do punish them if they do.

gkekoa · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
OK IM going to channel Sam Jackson here...

Motherfucka please.

Who owns the Banks in this country??
Who for the most part owns the housing industry and thus sets housing prices??
Who for the most part runs the government and MAKES the laws??

And how many times have you been presented with evidence, legal evidence of racial and systematic bias against people of color and simply brushed it off??

So like I said, you might not be a cross burning, I hate people of color racist. But you are damn sure comfortable with the system NOT changing anymore than it already has.

Black-owned banks include Oneunited, Liberty Bank and Trust, Citizens Trust, Industrial Bank, Harbor Bank of MD.

Nobody owns the housing industry and prices are set by the market.

As for the government, I assume you want me to say white people even though there are plenty of black members in both houses and we just had a black POTUS.

I have never been presented any evidence and brushed it off.

gkekoa · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
SO if you want a true color blind level playing field, that would require getting rid of

the census, any question designed to determine race on any type of application.

It would also require getting rid of for profit higher education, because lets be honest, a poor kid with a 4.0 GPA still might not be able to afford to go to college.

Require realistic housing standards and a realistic living wage. Because again, if that kid that got a 4.0 has to forgo college to take care of his family, then it is just feeding into the cycle that is broken.

I agree you cant solve discrimination by making another group feel discriminated against. But until such time as you can be assured that individuals wont discriminate, we do need laws in place to prevent them from doing just that. After all, not every one drives drunk, but we have laws in place to try prevent those who would make bad choices from driving drunk. And we do punish them if they do.

Pretty sure the census is in the Constitution. I am fine with getting rid of race related questions though.

A poor kid can take out a loan.

Wait...white men are not feeling anything...they are being discriminated against by an actual law...no feelings required.

Find a law that prevents discrimination. As usual, I will be waiting.

reptec101 · May 22, 2018

We still talking about slavery here... Damn. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that after month after month after month and page after page after page of talking bout this shit,,, nobody's opinions have changed in the least. When all ya'll had to do in the beginning was just listen to me and closed the books.

Sharkinva · May 22, 2018

gkekoa said:
Black-owned banks include Oneunited, Liberty Bank and Trust, Citizens Trust, Industrial Bank, Harbor Bank of MD.

Nobody owns the housing industry and prices are set by the market.

As for the government, I assume you want me to say white people even though there are plenty of black members in both houses and we just had a black POTUS.

I have never been presented any evidence and brushed it off.

And yet, you just did brush off not evidence, but reality.

a few black owned banks does not set lending policy. BUt I forget i have to be literal with you.

So Whites have owned the majority of the banking system and continue to control the vast majority of money that can be lent.

As the self same banks play a large part in the housing industry by making the loans, once again they own controlling interest in how the housing market is run.

And yes I know we FINALLY had a black president, boy are we going to pay for the audacity of that. The self same President for eight years had to fight against his own government to get anything done

Sharkinva · May 22, 2018

gkekoa said:
Pretty sure the census is in the Constitution. I am fine with getting rid of race related questions though.

A poor kid can take out a loan.

Wait...white men are not feeling anything...they are being discriminated against by an actual law...no feelings required.

Find a law that prevents discrimination. As usual, I will be waiting.

YOU claim to want a color blind society where every one has the same opportunity, I just gave you the answer. And you brushed it off.

As long as we actively keep count (score if you will) of how many whites vs every one else live in this country, its going to be an issue.

As long as they keep score on the number of crimes committed by racial and ethnic background, there will be an issue. Because these reports are designed to do exactly what they have. Help you form an opinion about where the real problem is. And as I have attempted to point out, the way they are presented is designed to elicit a particular response from people. They scream there are over 11 MILLION illegal immigrants in this country, and forget to mention that that is only 3% of the population as a whole.

Also, just to clear this thing up as far as laws being written to discriminate. I dont see a single law on the books any where that says if you are white, you cant do something. See that would be a law designed to discriminate. Affirmative action, the EEOC, those are policies designed to try and PREVENT discrimination, sort of like the Americans with disabilities act. Or does it make you feel discriminated against because you cant snag the premo parking spot at the mall too?

Sportster 72 · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
Agreed, and in the right company it doesnt really matter. I honestly dont think the problem is us normal folks for the most part. The issue is people in power pushing agendas to either keep or take power based on racial divide.

And for the record I would love to have a beer and watch football with your twisted harley riding irish Scot ass. I would feel sorry for the Eagles/Giants or Cowboys fans in the room though.

I would like that too. It would be fun.

Politicians from both sides use anything they can to divide us and in their mind help themselves. That isn't changing anytime soon. Brother can be an all encompassing word, we should all learn to use it more.

gkekoa · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
And yet, you just did brush off not evidence, but reality.

a few black owned banks does not set lending policy. BUt I forget i have to be literal with you.

So Whites have owned the majority of the banking system and continue to control the vast majority of money that can be lent.

As the self same banks play a large part in the housing industry by making the loans, once again they own controlling interest in how the housing market is run.

And yes I know we FINALLY had a black president, boy are we going to pay for the audacity of that. The self same President for eight years had to fight against his own government to get anything done

What evidence did I brush off?

Those are the top five...there are many more. And they do set lending policy in their banks that have to follow federal law. Federal law requires banks loan money to minorities and would you like to guess who has the highest rate of default? This is just student loans...There's a Massive Racial Gap in Student Loan Defaults, New Data Show

Eight years? Wrong. He had both houses for the first two and they managed to destroy the healthcaresystem. Well done. If you want to see obstructionist, look at what is going on now because the Republicans don’t play by the same rules as democrats.

Sharkinva · May 22, 2018

gkekoa said:
What evidence did I brush off?

Those are the top five...there are many more. And they do set lending policy in their banks that have to follow federal law. Federal law requires banks loan money to minorities and would you like to guess who has the highest rate of default? This is just student loans...There's a Massive Racial Gap in Student Loan Defaults, New Data Show

Eight years? Wrong. He had both houses for the first two and they managed to destroy the healthcaresystem. Well done. If you want to see obstructionist, look at what is going on now because the Republicans don’t play by the same rules as democrats.

Hmm I wonder if there might be any reason why blacks are more likely to default or fall behind on Student loans

African-Americans With College Degrees Are Twice As Likely to Be Unemployed as Other Graduates

gkekoa · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
YOU claim to want a color blind society where every one has the same opportunity, I just gave you the answer. And you brushed it off.

As long as we actively keep count (score if you will) of how many whites vs every one else live in this country, its going to be an issue.

As long as they keep score on the number of crimes committed by racial and ethnic background, there will be an issue. Because these reports are designed to do exactly what they have. Help you form an opinion about where the real problem is. And as I have attempted to point out, the way they are presented is designed to elicit a particular response from people. They scream there are over 11 MILLION illegal immigrants in this country, and forget to mention that that is only 3% of the population as a whole.

Also, just to clear this thing up as far as laws being written to discriminate. I dont see a single law on the books any where that says if you are white, you cant do something. See that would be a law designed to discriminate. Affirmative action, the EEOC, those are policies designed to try and PREVENT discrimination, sort of like the Americans with disabilities act. Or does it make you feel discriminated against because you cant snag the premo parking spot at the mall too?

I didn’t brush it off. I am for it but the census is in the Constitution. To change it we need a convention of states which liberals definitely do not want.

I agree keeping score isn’t really doing a damn thing that is good. Then again, it at least gives me a rebuttal as to why people have stereotypes. 11-34 million, 3 to 11%. Only 1.3% of deaths in the US were from guns, yet liberals want them gone...and guns are legal. Kind of a stupid argument.

14th Amendment of the Constitution...No state shall deny any person within its jurisdiction equal protection under the law. How is it equal protection to favor one race, sex, gender, orientation, or religion with federal incentives? So, when you make a law that doesn’t say whites don’t get this protection but it says blacks, Asians, Hispanics, Hawaiians, Pacific Islanders, Indians get a federal incentive, it is discrimination by omission.

gkekoa · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
Hmm I wonder if there might be any reason why blacks are more likely to default or fall behind on Student loans

African-Americans With College Degrees Are Twice As Likely to Be Unemployed as Other Graduates

Yes...perhaps, they did not do as well in college. Perhaps, they did not do well in the interviews. Perhaps, they chose not to accept the menial job to pay the bills until they got a job.

No matter the reason, would you lend 100k to a person that is more or less likely to pay it back?

Sharkinva · May 22, 2018

gkekoa said:
Yes...perhaps, they did not do as well in college. Perhaps, they did not do well in the interviews. Perhaps, they chose not to accept the menial job to pay the bills until they got a job.

No matter the reason, would you lend 100k to a person that is more or less likely to pay it back?

Perhaps if my aunt had nuts she would actually be my uncle. If the numbers were 1 or 2 cases, you might have an argument that did NOT involve the fostering and upkeep of systematic discrimination. But the truth is, it has been going on for so long in this country, it has just been accepted as the way things are.

I do find i ironic though that after 100 years of the 14th amendment being little more than window dressing, NOW people want to hold to the letter of the law. Funny how that works.

gkekoa · May 22, 2018

Sharkinva said:
Perhaps if my aunt had nuts she would actually be my uncle. If the numbers were 1 or 2 cases, you might have an argument that did NOT involve the fostering and upkeep of systematic discrimination. But the truth is, it has been going on for so long in this country, it has just been accepted as the way things are.

I do find i ironic though that after 100 years of the 14th amendment being little more than window dressing, NOW people want to hold to the letter of the law. Funny how that works.

Because it is much easier for you to accept people are against blacks instead of it being a character flaw that shows more in black folk. If it were 1or 2cases, it would be coincidence. It is statistically relevant because it comes over the entire population.

You find it ironic that white person is talking about the 14th even though white people wrote it?

Sharkinva · May 22, 2018

gkekoa said:
Because it is much easier for you to accept people are against blacks instead of it being a character flaw that shows more in black folk. If it were 1or 2cases, it would be coincidence. It is statistically relevant because it comes over the entire population.

You find it ironic that white person is talking about the 14th even though white people wrote it?

Nah.. actually the irony is that you can claim discrimination against whites and yet wont even consider that it still exists against non whites in this country. That you want to group most blacks into a group of undesirables, well unless they are like Ben Carson and Mia Love and know their place. Yet take offense if any one lumps all white men into the group with the David Dukes, Stephen Paddocks, or Devin Kelly's of the world. That you proclaim these guys as damaged individuals, but most blacks are a part of a flawed culture.

So the irony is in the self serving double standard.

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