What to do with Jimmy?

jakedog56 · Sep 20, 2017

Some thoughts being tossed around:

*Trade him.
Getting the necessary decent OL player for him plus a possible draft pick seems like a lot considering the current league wide crisis in the offensive trenches. Getting less than that would seem like a defeat considering he is an elite athletic tight end.

*Do nothing.
The slow start is only an anomaly. He produced at a good level last year and he will bounce back with improved OL play. But his lack of blocking ability is contributing to the OL issue, so it is a bit of a quandary.

......and my fav idea.......

*Move him to WR.
He is already essentially a WR who lines up inside instead of outside. Quit fighting his lack of fit into our scheme and split his 6'7" / 250+ pound frame to the outside where he can be a huge mismatch to opposing D's who will be forced to move a large safety/LB hybrid type outside with him or be stuck with a guy 7 to 9 inches shorter and much lighter than him. Luke Willson is a better blocker and can still contribute as a receiver also. Add one of the several blocking TEs currently out there as free agents to fill in the open spot. WRs are now Baldwin/Graham/Richardson/Lockett.

Any thoughts?

flyerhawk · Sep 20, 2017

I don't think there is any reason to make any drastic change. Trading him would get us pennies on the dollar. Moving him to WR limits his capabilities.

Cloud · Sep 20, 2017

If they're bringing him in to just block then they need to get rid of him.... mainly because he is a very very expensive olineman that sucks. At some point they need to give up on his blocking ability and allow him to be what he is.... a threat at receiving.

His receiving abilities are still top notch.

jakedog56 · Sep 20, 2017

Cloud said:
If they're bringing him in to just block then they need to get rid of him.... mainly because he is a very very expensive olineman that sucks. At some point they need to give up on his blocking ability and allow him to be what he is.... a threat at receiving.

His receiving abilities are still top notch.

So would you prefer to leave him at TE and hope that Russ doesn't get killed in the meantime, or do you think the splitting him out to WR idea?

jakedog56 · Sep 20, 2017

flyerhawk said:
I don't think there is any reason to make any drastic change. Trading him would get us pennies on the dollar. Moving him to WR limits his capabilities.

How would moving him to WR limit his capabilities? If anything it would seem to be a better fit since he can't block worth a crap.

Mariners_44 · Sep 21, 2017

jakedog56 said:
How would moving him to WR limit his capabilities? If anything it would seem to be a better fit since he can't block worth a crap.

Because he lacks route running, otherwise he probably would be an outside WR.

IMO, I wish it had worked but I think it's time to move him. The longer we continue trying to implement him into the system the more the continued lack of production will bring us down.

Cloud · Sep 21, 2017

jakedog56 said:
So would you prefer to leave him at TE and hope that Russ doesn't get killed in the meantime, or do you think the splitting him out to WR idea?

He's a receiving TE, period. He does not fit well with the current scheme where they have TE's help with the blocking. Willson is a better blocker anyway so they need to just give up on Jimmy blocking and start using him as a receiver more or just trade him if they want him to continue blocking. Jimmy's poor blocking ability makes no difference on whether or not Russ gets killed.

Screamin12th · Sep 21, 2017

most teams have a receiving TE and a Blocking one. Some are lucky to have one that does both extremely well. Graham is a offensive weapon that is not being used as much or in the way he should be and as most would like and yes i believe it has hurt the team. Then having such a POOR oline forces the Hawks hand and forces Graham to "try" and block. So it all comes back to the bigger issue the Oline.

With out competent blocking from the Oline Grahams hands and that of the Seahawks are tied. This is his final season and unless his price tag drops ( highly doubt it ) he wont be a Seahawk next season. Sad that the olines incompetence has had such a negative effect on one of the best TE in the game.

MKHawk · Sep 21, 2017

If we were going to do something drastic here, it needed to happen in the offseason. Changing his role to straight WR isn't something that's going to work now.

Plus, things like Jimmy not getting red zone targets and Russ seemingly being reluctant to throw to him when he doesn't get separation (which is often) aren't going to go away with a position change.

flyerhawk · Sep 21, 2017

MKHawk said:
If we were going to do something drastic here, it needed to happen in the offseason. Changing his role to straight WR isn't something that's going to work now.

Plus, things like Jimmy not getting red zone targets and Russ seemingly being reluctant to throw to him when he doesn't get separation (which is often) aren't going to go away with a position change.

The big differences between a WR and TE is that a TE is expected to block bigger people and a WR is supposed to stretch the field.

Jimmy has a lot of talents but he isn't a field stretcher. He doesn't have that kind of speed. If he's put out wide and covered by a CB then you are essentially conceding that he will be covered and hoping the QB can put the ball in a place that the CB can't reach because he is presumably much shorter than Jimmy.

When he would split out wide for the Saints it was usually part of a 4 or 5 receiver set. The whole point was to create matchup problems. But keeping him out wide doesn't make sense.

JMR · Sep 21, 2017

Stay the course overall but consider more opportunities with him split instead of inline. A lot of people think this trade hasn't worked and/or he isn't a good fit here, but in '15 he was the team's leading receiver going into the game he hurt his knee, then last year he bounced back with 65 catches for over 900 yards. Both achievements unprecedented for a TE in this franchise. His volume stats were never going to match what we saw from him in NO because we simply don't throw the ball 40 times a game like they do.

When we only kept 5 WRs, I was expecting to see more 12 personnel (1 RB, 2 TEs) with Jimmy not lined up as an inline TE but it doesn't seem like that was the plan. I personally think that would unlock his talent a bit more, but maybe that will also happen if we pick up the offensive pace a bit.

DJ · Sep 21, 2017

It's the play-calling.....

boogiewithstu2007 · Sep 21, 2017

flyerhawk said:
I don't think there is any reason to make any drastic change. Trading him would get us pennies on the dollar. Moving him to WR limits his capabilities.

Jimmy at WR is a match-up nightmare for DB's ... We have to just admit blocking is not his game, we need to play to his strengths... I'm seriously surprised Pete hasn't used him at WR ... How do you feel having him at WR would limit his capabilities ?

flyerhawk · Sep 21, 2017

boogiewithstu2007 said:
How do you feel having him at WR would limit his capabilities ?

Because Jimmy doesn't have the speed to run receiver routes and is not a great route runner to begin with.

He's great value is being mismatched against a slow LB or safety. Or matching up against a corner in space. Pinning him against the sideline or having him run crossing routes takes away almost all of his real value.

Maybe he could be a WR in a spread offense where you can put him all over the field and force bad matchups but not for our offense.

jakedog56 · Sep 21, 2017

True he is not a speed burner but his size should more than offset that. Not all WRs are sprinters so I would assume that route running would be the bigger concern and I would think Graham is familiar enough with Seattle receiver tree structure to be able to handle it to some extent.

flyerhawk · Sep 21, 2017

jakedog56 said:
True he is not a speed burner but his size should more than offset that. Not all WRs are sprinters so I would assume that route running would be the bigger concern and I would think Graham is familiar enough with Seattle receiver tree structure to be able to handle it to some extent.

It's not that he doesn't know the routes. He just doesn't routes very well. His cuts aren't precise and he doesn't come out of the cuts cleanly.

His size is helpful but if he can't get open that means it's always a jump ball. That isn't the path to a successful offense.

MrS · Sep 21, 2017

Offer him to houston for duane brown, straight up.

jakedog56 · Sep 21, 2017

flyerhawk said:
It's not that he doesn't know the routes. He just doesn't routes very well. His cuts aren't precise and he doesn't come out of the cuts cleanly.

His size is helpful but if he can't get open that means it's always a jump ball. That isn't the path to a successful offense.

Neither is Russell running for his life. Better blocking from the TE possession and the possibility of a lob to Graham certainly seems to be a better option than what we are currently doing.

flyerhawk · Sep 21, 2017

jakedog56 said:
Neither is Russell running for his life. Better blocking from the TE possession and the possibility of a lob to Graham certainly seems to be a better option than what we are currently doing.

Well he can do that from the TE position. TEs aren't required to be part of the blocking scheme.

I also think his blocking issues are being wildly overblown. I'll take his inconsistent blocking over the nightmare at LT and RG we have been watching.

Anointed One · Sep 21, 2017

DJ said:
It's the play-calling.....

Most of it is execution, or lack-there-of...

What to do with Jimmy?

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