When will Lebron pass Jordan?

[tlance]

This is what makes arguing and debating the top 5 even more fun - there's no definitive answer.

Some people have LeBron as the GOAT, some #2, most at #4 or 5.

But to get shitty because someone doesn't definitively have him in the top 2 is just pathetic

Most had him top 4 before this season.

If we do another top 10 all time great rank this summer on here, I am willing to bet that his consensus rank will be #2.

He will get his fair share of #1 votes, while Magic or Kareem will get very few, if any. That will balance out those that have him 3 or lower.

And I agree with @Mecca. Anybody who ranks him lower than 5 doesn't deserve to have a vote.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Most had him top 4 before this season.

If we do another top 10 all time great rank this summer on here, I am willing to bet that his consensus rank will be #2.

He will get his fair share of #1 votes, while Magic or Kareem will get very few, if any. That will balance out those that have him 3 or lower.

And I agree with @Mecca. Anybody who ranks him lower than 5 doesn't deserve to have a vote.

Might be an interesting poll to do after the season has ended. I think how he performs in the ECF and possibly Finals might affect his rating by one or two places.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Might be an interesting poll to do after the season has ended. I think how he performs in the ECF and possibly Finals might affect his rating by one or two places.

I think he is in the top 5, but that's pretty hard when you have so many players that actually more championships - Kareem Abdul Jabaar, Magic Johnson, Kobe Bryant, Michael Johnson all belong up there in my book. And what about many of the others - What I believe confuses people is LeBron's athleticism and power - which really makes him the most athletic player of all time, but I do think there quite a few players who had more talent.

 

[DorianRo]

Lebron will begin to have a few arguments if he can beat the Warriors in the finals this year. Until then, He's the lower rung of the top 10. (maybe just below depending on what you value and other factors). If he loses to the Celtics or just gets his rear handed to him against a quality team again in the finals then he stays put>. A 3-6 finals record or getting beat by a team missing their 2 best players isn't gonna do him any favors on a GOAT list

 

[tlance]

Lebron will begin to have a few arguments if he can beat the Warriors in the finals this year. Until then, He's the lower rung of the top 10. (maybe just below depending on what you value and other factors). If he loses to the Celtics or just gets his rear handed to him against a quality team again in the finals then he stays put>. A 3-6 finals record or getting beat by a team missing their 2 best players isn't gonna do him any favors on a GOAT list

Case and point.

Damn fool right here for you @Mecca

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Lebron will begin to have a few arguments if he can beat the Warriors in the finals this year. Until then, He's the lower rung of the top 10. (maybe just below depending on what you value and other factors). If he loses to the Celtics or just gets his rear handed to him against a quality team again in the finals then he stays put>. A 3-6 finals record or getting beat by a team missing their 2 best players isn't gonna do him any favors on a GOAT list

First: That's not a fair assessment because the Warriors is to strong for anyone to beat

Second - It's not going to happen

Third: I don't think LeBron and Jordan can be compared because they played in two different eras. Michael Jordan single handedly brought down the Detroit Bad Boys and the thug mentality in the NBA - that was one hell of an accomplishment over LeBron

 

[DorianRo]

First: That's not a fair assessment because the Warriors is to strong for anyone to beat

Second - It's not going to happen

Third: I don't think LeBron and Jordan can be compared because they played in two different eras. Michael Jordan single handedly brought down the Detroit Bad Boys and the thug mentality in the NBA - that was one hell of an accomplishment over LeBron

Thats why if he DOES do it, then he deserves to be in the conversation. Fact is, LeBron has been on great teams Every year since 2010. Thats 8 years, 8 finals appearance (pending this year) and only 3 titles to his name. How else can he be argued into GOAT status with Michael with only 3 titles and a 3-6 finals record?


Michael slayed the Bad Boys, (and other solid East teams), LeBron needs to slay the Warriors with Durant and add on to his 3 titles. Because 3 titles (despite 8 years of solid supporting help and all star/HOFers) just doesn't cut it at the moment. More titles are the deal breaker.


Its always when LeBron gets to the finals, " he has tomato can teammates". Always some excuse. If you're getting to 8 straight finals, you got a damn team good team ROFLMAO.

I can't think of anyone who has played with more talent than LeBron since 2010. Not overall. Between Miami and Cleveland the guy has had more supporting help than ANYONE. Thats a fact, not up for discussion

 

[DorianRo]

Hell even beating the Rockets, LeBron will begin to have some arguments on his side. Though I doubt Houston will be in the finals unless key players on GS get injured or something

OTOH, if loses to Boston without their 2 best players, his stock drops significantly

 

[jon2tanman]

Just a little history about Kareem. I didn't know he still held so many records for the bucks.
Kareem | Milwaukee Bucks

 

[handicappers]

Hell even beating the Rockets, LeBron will begin to have some arguments on his side. Though I doubt Houston will be in the finals unless key players on GS get injured or something

OTOH, if loses to Boston without their 2 best players, his stock drops significantly

What two players?

 

[handicappers]

First: That's not a fair assessment because the Warriors is to strong for anyone to beat

Second - It's not going to happen

Third: I don't think LeBron and Jordan can be compared because they played in two different eras. Michael Jordan single handedly brought down the Detroit Bad Boys and the thug mentality in the NBA - that was one hell of an accomplishment over LeBron

Lol

Single handedly, huh?

Derp

 

[Raw_Bee808]

Just a little history about Kareem. I didn't know he still held so many records for the bucks.
Kareem | Milwaukee Bucks

Kareem definitely has an argument for being the GOAT, I know a lot of older guys who still swear he's the best player ever but personally I don't put him in my top 5 because I only saw him play when he was old and well past his prime, but there his no doubt he has the resume.

 

[Raw_Bee808]

double

 

[larryjohn]

He also put Kobe ahead of LeBron

But the question was "who doesn't have Lebron in the Top 5?"

 

[tlance]

But the question was "who doesn't have Lebron in the Top 5?"

At this point, if someone has LeBron outside of the top 5 they are one of the following:

Biased
Stupid
Old and under the delusion that greats from the 60s are as good as today's greats

Or some combination of the 3

 

[flyerhawk]

Lebron will begin to have a few arguments if he can beat the Warriors in the finals this year. Until then, He's the lower rung of the top 10. (maybe just below depending on what you value and other factors). If he loses to the Celtics or just gets his rear handed to him against a quality team again in the finals then he stays put>. A 3-6 finals record or getting beat by a team missing their 2 best players isn't gonna do him any favors on a GOAT list

Top 10? Hell he's barely top 50.

Whenever he wins it because of others. Whenever he loses it is his fault alone.

 

[desert heat]

It shouldn't be.

Finals losses as some kind of stain is ridiculous.

Kareem isn't as good as Jordan because he wasn't as good as Jordan. 5 of Kareem's
titles came with Magic. Most of which he wasn't even the best player on his Own team.

But, if the only thing that mattered was team accomplishments, then I will take 6-4 over 6-0 because he got there 4 more times and won just as many.

kareem was a better scorer, rebounder, and defensive player than jordan. kareem was past his prime most of the years he played with magic. the lakers also played better competition than the bulls, and didn't get near the preferential treatment from the refs as the bulls did. kareem was also able to win championships with two different organizations.

but i'll agree team accomplishments are not all that matters, because basketball is a team sport not an individual sport. otherwise bill russell is easily the goat.

 

[tlance]

kareem was a better scorer, rebounder, and defensive player than jordan. kareem was past his prime most of the years he played with magic. the lakers also played better competition than the bulls, and didn't get near the preferential treatment from the refs as the bulls did. kareem was also able to win championships with two different organizations.

but i'll agree team accomplishments are not all that matters, because basketball is a team sport not an individual sport. otherwise bill russell is easily the goat.

Kareem was not a better scorer than Jordan. It is kind of crazy to say he was a better defender also. Centers are supposed to be the anchor of a team defense. It is literally his job. If you made a list of the best defensive centers of all time, I do not think Kareem would be on very many top 10s.

Jordan, however would be in just about everybody's top 5 wing defender list. He would make the top spot on more than a few.

Relative to their positional value, Jordan's defense is a lot harder to replace than Kareem's.

 

[desert heat]

Kareem was not a better scorer than Jordan. It is kind of crazy to say he was a better defender also. Centers are supposed to be the anchor of a team defense. It is literally his job. If you made a list of the best defensive centers of all time, I do not think Kareem would be on very many top 10s.

Jordan, however would be in just about everybody's top 5 wing defender list. He would make the top spot on more than a few.

Relative to their positional value, Jordan's defense is a lot harder to replace than Kareem's.

even though there were better defensive centers than kareem, like wilt, kareem still had far more impact defensively, than any #2 guard. centers can clog the middle. kareem is the leading scorer in nba history. the sky hook was by far the the most unstoppable shot ever.

 

[Wamu]

kareem was a better scorer, rebounder, and defensive player than jordan. kareem was past his prime most of the years he played with magic. the lakers also played better competition than the bulls, and didn't get near the preferential treatment from the refs as the bulls did. kareem was also able to win championships with two different organizations.

but i'll agree team accomplishments are not all that matters, because basketball is a team sport not an individual sport. otherwise bill russell is easily the goat.

I stopped reading your comment after you said kareem was a better scorer. How do you figure? MJ led the league in scoring 9 times. Kareem twice. MJ averaged @ least 28.0 ppg 11 times. Kareem 5 times. And then there's that thing about MJ averaging more ppg (30.1) than anyone that's ever played the game.